1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,470 The following content is provided under a Creative 2 00:00:02,470 --> 00:00:03,880 Commons license. 3 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:06,920 Your support will help MIT OpenCourseWare continue to 4 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:10,570 offer high quality educational resources for free. 5 00:00:10,570 --> 00:00:13,470 To make a donation, or view additional materials from 6 00:00:13,470 --> 00:00:17,400 hundreds of MIT courses, visit MIT OpenCourseWare at 7 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:18,650 ocw.mit.edu. 8 00:00:20,994 --> 00:00:22,425 PROFESSOR: Welcome back. 9 00:00:22,425 --> 00:00:25,287 Thanks for not dropping the class yet. 10 00:00:25,287 --> 00:00:27,672 AUDIENCE: I'm going to do that right now. 11 00:00:27,672 --> 00:00:30,060 PROFESSOR: Funny you mention that. 12 00:00:30,060 --> 00:00:32,900 Let's see, just a reminder. 13 00:00:32,900 --> 00:00:34,940 Actually one big reminder for folks who weren't here on 14 00:00:34,940 --> 00:00:38,850 Friday is that we swapped around Friday and Monday's-- 15 00:00:38,850 --> 00:00:39,340 AUDIENCE: Yeah, I think 17th and the 16 00:00:39,340 --> 00:00:41,160 20th have been swapped. 17 00:00:41,160 --> 00:00:41,690 PROFESSOR: Yeah. 18 00:00:41,690 --> 00:00:43,158 AUDIENCE: In terms of reading that we're going 19 00:00:43,158 --> 00:00:44,730 to do in the class. 20 00:00:44,730 --> 00:00:46,136 PROFESSOR: So, we're still going to be playing 21 00:00:46,136 --> 00:00:49,140 the games on Friday. 22 00:00:49,140 --> 00:00:52,249 But the brainstorming activity that we had scheduled for 23 00:00:52,249 --> 00:00:55,225 Monday is going to be on this Friday instead. 24 00:00:55,225 --> 00:00:56,620 And then later on in the course. 25 00:00:59,310 --> 00:01:00,560 Anyone manage to get through the reading? 26 00:01:04,034 --> 00:01:07,520 Let's see, where should we start. 27 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:11,440 So there was a Doug Church article that was on Gamasutra. 28 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,312 And if you're familiar with Gamasutra, or if you're not 29 00:01:14,312 --> 00:01:21,150 actually, it's a fairly well-read news and industry 30 00:01:21,150 --> 00:01:26,790 news blog for the video game industry. 31 00:01:26,790 --> 00:01:30,890 That particular article, I think, was originally written 32 00:01:30,890 --> 00:01:34,850 not for the website but for the magazine that the 33 00:01:34,850 --> 00:01:37,990 associated company publishes, the Game Developer magazine. 34 00:01:37,990 --> 00:01:39,940 And Doug Church is actually an MIT alum. 35 00:01:43,764 --> 00:01:46,154 The other article that was read, Mark [INAUDIBLE], 36 00:01:46,154 --> 00:01:47,588 they're both MIT alums. 37 00:01:47,588 --> 00:01:48,838 So that's one thing. 38 00:01:50,580 --> 00:01:54,670 So Doug Church proposes a set of tools. 39 00:01:54,670 --> 00:01:56,870 And remember what they're called? 40 00:01:56,870 --> 00:01:58,120 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 41 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:08,590 PROFESSOR: So, and Mark's framework which is-- 42 00:02:08,590 --> 00:02:09,840 AUDIENCE: M-A-D? 43 00:02:14,570 --> 00:02:15,750 PROFESSOR: And we covered mechanics 44 00:02:15,750 --> 00:02:18,740 and dynamics on Friday. 45 00:02:18,740 --> 00:02:21,260 And today we have a little bit of time to talk about 46 00:02:21,260 --> 00:02:21,440 aesthetics. 47 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:24,900 But the reason why these two essays were put right next to 48 00:02:24,900 --> 00:02:30,443 each other was MDA is an example of what Doug Church 49 00:02:30,443 --> 00:02:33,470 was describing as [INAUDIBLE]. 50 00:02:33,470 --> 00:02:37,990 In fact, at the time when MDA came out it was pretty much 51 00:02:37,990 --> 00:02:42,400 the only one that caught on. 52 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:44,840 Everybody, all of the problems that Doug Church lays out in 53 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:47,678 his article about the problems that we don't have a 54 00:02:47,678 --> 00:02:50,018 vocabulary, a consistent vocabulary, to talk about our 55 00:02:50,018 --> 00:02:53,210 craft and thus we can't actually deal with it. 56 00:02:53,210 --> 00:02:58,680 And thus we need some formal tools that everyone uses. 57 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,770 Unfortunately not much has caught on. 58 00:03:01,770 --> 00:03:06,950 MDA being one of the few that has. 59 00:03:06,950 --> 00:03:08,320 For a number of different reasons. 60 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:12,580 First of all, it actually is a useful framework. 61 00:03:12,580 --> 00:03:15,960 You can think of many, many, ways to properly look at games 62 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,716 but for a designer you need to think of something where you 63 00:03:18,716 --> 00:03:21,050 can actually apply it to help improve your games. 64 00:03:21,050 --> 00:03:27,560 And MDA actually gives you a reason why design is hard. 65 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,450 So if nothing else, designers like it a lot because it says 66 00:03:30,450 --> 00:03:31,800 this is why their job is hard. 67 00:03:34,730 --> 00:03:37,920 The reason being, you get to control the mechanics. 68 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:39,340 But that's not what you're going for. 69 00:03:39,340 --> 00:03:41,970 You're not going for really interesting mechanics. 70 00:03:41,970 --> 00:03:43,870 They're going for really interesting aesthetics. 71 00:03:43,870 --> 00:03:47,590 They're going for a fun, engaging, play experience. 72 00:03:47,590 --> 00:03:49,514 There are mock-- 73 00:03:49,514 --> 00:03:53,330 in the MDA paper, this lists eight kinds of fun. 74 00:03:53,330 --> 00:03:55,810 And I've asked him about this when we give this presentation 75 00:03:55,810 --> 00:03:58,920 here in MIT. 76 00:03:58,920 --> 00:04:00,210 Those eight were not meant to be comprehensive. 77 00:04:00,210 --> 00:04:02,130 They were meant to be, these are the eight that I could 78 00:04:02,130 --> 00:04:03,380 think of at the time. 79 00:04:05,215 --> 00:04:07,130 After this I'm going for [INAUDIBLE] 80 00:04:07,130 --> 00:04:10,155 that's a bouquet of different kinds of fun. 81 00:04:10,155 --> 00:04:12,660 Different kinds of experiences that people are trying to get 82 00:04:12,660 --> 00:04:13,810 out of playing games. 83 00:04:13,810 --> 00:04:15,960 That's what a game designer is trying to get. 84 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,060 The only problem is that a game designer doesn't actually 85 00:04:18,060 --> 00:04:19,565 control that experience. 86 00:04:19,565 --> 00:04:22,600 The game designer only gets to upload mechanics. 87 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:25,010 Depending on what company you are, maybe you have the title 88 00:04:25,010 --> 00:04:28,777 of game designer but you're also in charge of the art. 89 00:04:28,777 --> 00:04:30,210 You're actually also the lead programmer. 90 00:04:30,210 --> 00:04:32,180 It's possible that you also have more control over things 91 00:04:32,180 --> 00:04:33,760 than just the mechanics. 92 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:38,800 But most designers, mechanics is what the job still is. 93 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:43,860 So they write the rules, the rules interact in some sort of 94 00:04:43,860 --> 00:04:47,486 like ridiculously hard to predict way, and then you get 95 00:04:47,486 --> 00:04:49,880 the experience of playing the game, the aesthetic. 96 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,405 And you hope that's what you were going for. 97 00:04:52,405 --> 00:04:53,990 It usually isn't. 98 00:04:53,990 --> 00:04:59,020 And then you make a change to the mechanics and try again. 99 00:04:59,020 --> 00:05:00,710 The nice thing about that, is that works really well with 100 00:05:00,710 --> 00:05:01,650 the rate of design. 101 00:05:01,650 --> 00:05:05,350 In fact, without a rate of design it becomes really hard 102 00:05:05,350 --> 00:05:06,960 to control this kind of process. 103 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:12,701 Because basically, we are two orders removed from the 104 00:05:12,701 --> 00:05:14,380 experience that you're trying to create. 105 00:05:14,380 --> 00:05:20,350 It's like trying to draw on a piece of paper where not only 106 00:05:20,350 --> 00:05:24,200 can you not see the paper that you're drawing on, you're also 107 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:28,831 controlling the brush or the pencil tied to a stick, or 108 00:05:28,831 --> 00:05:30,250 something like that, blindfolded. 109 00:05:30,250 --> 00:05:31,669 That's kind of what making game designs are like. 110 00:05:34,910 --> 00:05:39,860 So that's the experience of the game design side. 111 00:05:39,860 --> 00:05:41,620 You can control the mechanics, and they're going towards some 112 00:05:41,620 --> 00:05:42,630 sort of aesthetic. 113 00:05:42,630 --> 00:05:45,692 And from the other side, the player is experiencing some 114 00:05:45,692 --> 00:05:50,960 kind of aesthetic and they can sort of work their way back. 115 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,610 It's like, I'm getting this kind of experience. 116 00:05:53,610 --> 00:05:55,330 Why am I getting this kind of experience? 117 00:05:55,330 --> 00:05:58,415 If you've got a particularly insightful game player, maybe 118 00:05:58,415 --> 00:06:01,340 they're taking CMS.300 Introduction to Video Games, 119 00:06:01,340 --> 00:06:03,730 and you're analyzing games. 120 00:06:03,730 --> 00:06:06,650 And you're trying to say, how did we get here? 121 00:06:06,650 --> 00:06:08,130 If anything in this class, you're going to be 122 00:06:08,130 --> 00:06:09,250 doing that a lot. 123 00:06:09,250 --> 00:06:15,670 This game, Heroes Might and Magic 3 for instance, has-- 124 00:06:15,670 --> 00:06:18,210 give me a particularly-- 125 00:06:18,210 --> 00:06:18,740 a sensation. 126 00:06:18,740 --> 00:06:21,538 Describe a sensation that you got when you were playing that 127 00:06:21,538 --> 00:06:24,870 game, that you recall. 128 00:06:24,870 --> 00:06:26,280 AUDIENCE: Strategic. 129 00:06:26,280 --> 00:06:27,250 Out-smarting. 130 00:06:27,250 --> 00:06:28,830 To saying to friends. 131 00:06:28,830 --> 00:06:30,890 Outsmart them. 132 00:06:30,890 --> 00:06:31,550 Stump me. 133 00:06:31,550 --> 00:06:33,596 PROFESSOR: Seem smart, make you have to think really hard 134 00:06:33,596 --> 00:06:34,510 and everything. 135 00:06:34,510 --> 00:06:36,925 So then you think about what dynamics might 136 00:06:36,925 --> 00:06:40,170 have resulted in that. 137 00:06:40,170 --> 00:06:41,940 AUDIENCE: Fog of War. 138 00:06:41,940 --> 00:06:44,090 PROFESSOR: For you to figure out is behind the 139 00:06:44,090 --> 00:06:45,750 areas you can't see. 140 00:06:45,750 --> 00:06:48,676 But it has some information that you can see that will 141 00:06:48,676 --> 00:06:49,900 give you clues. 142 00:06:49,900 --> 00:06:53,745 And then, Fog of War might already be a mechanic. 143 00:06:53,745 --> 00:06:56,460 The idea of, there is information that you can 144 00:06:56,460 --> 00:06:58,050 deduce even though you can't actually see it. 145 00:06:58,050 --> 00:07:02,790 And there's some probability of getting it right based on 146 00:07:02,790 --> 00:07:04,660 their experience with games. 147 00:07:04,660 --> 00:07:09,280 Fog of War being one game that gets you there. 148 00:07:09,280 --> 00:07:11,020 So you can analyze it backwards. 149 00:07:11,020 --> 00:07:14,110 And figure out, OK that's one thing Fog of War gets you. 150 00:07:14,110 --> 00:07:16,230 Sometimes Fog of War just confuses you. 151 00:07:16,230 --> 00:07:18,990 There could be anything behind this corner. 152 00:07:18,990 --> 00:07:22,097 I mean technically, Final Fantasy random combat system 153 00:07:22,097 --> 00:07:23,663 is like Fog of War. 154 00:07:23,663 --> 00:07:25,530 I don't know if there is a random encounter here, I will 155 00:07:25,530 --> 00:07:29,284 walk into it. 156 00:07:29,284 --> 00:07:30,534 AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]. 157 00:07:36,710 --> 00:07:38,010 AUDIENCE: That's where Unix merger is complete-- 158 00:07:38,010 --> 00:07:40,732 Plan to the classic Final Fantasy one with slides and 159 00:07:40,732 --> 00:07:41,982 the classic [INAUDIBLE]. 160 00:07:49,430 --> 00:07:51,670 PROFESSOR: But there is actually a problem-- 161 00:07:51,670 --> 00:07:53,500 actually, I don't need to write this down. 162 00:07:53,500 --> 00:07:55,580 There is a problem with-- 163 00:07:55,580 --> 00:07:57,680 well, maybe it's not a problem. 164 00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:00,170 There is an issue that I have with [INAUDIBLE]. 165 00:08:03,220 --> 00:08:07,210 Doug Church uses it specifically to say, well it 166 00:08:07,210 --> 00:08:09,610 should be sort of a serious business right? 167 00:08:09,610 --> 00:08:12,850 It's formal with a capital F. We're not talking about how 168 00:08:12,850 --> 00:08:16,070 cool this game is, we want to be very precise in our 169 00:08:16,070 --> 00:08:17,320 vocabulary. 170 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:21,760 We want to treat it like a serious business with a 171 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:22,930 capital S, capital B. 172 00:08:22,930 --> 00:08:27,733 However, the other assumption with the word formal comes 173 00:08:27,733 --> 00:08:29,817 from [INAUDIBLE]. 174 00:08:29,817 --> 00:08:32,360 You are thinking about the form of the game. 175 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:33,730 In a way that if you were trying to apply the same 176 00:08:33,730 --> 00:08:36,400 technique to talk about art you'd be talking about the 177 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:38,280 form of visual art. 178 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,100 The form of cinema. 179 00:08:41,100 --> 00:08:45,660 And that is actually a very narrow way to look at 180 00:08:45,660 --> 00:08:48,260 something, at a topic, that is as broad as a game. 181 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:57,760 It is as if we were trying to analyze something like 182 00:08:57,760 --> 00:08:59,220 [INAUDIBLE] 183 00:08:59,220 --> 00:09:01,470 and completely ignoring the fact that you were playing it 184 00:09:01,470 --> 00:09:04,530 with friends from French class. 185 00:09:04,530 --> 00:09:07,120 That would be an example of, well that had nothing to do 186 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:08,680 with the game. 187 00:09:08,680 --> 00:09:11,238 Well actually, it probably had a lot to do with how you 188 00:09:11,238 --> 00:09:12,488 experienced the game. 189 00:09:15,510 --> 00:09:18,920 Play, that's the rules of chess. 190 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:21,900 And you could just look at the game based on 191 00:09:21,900 --> 00:09:23,750 the rules of chess. 192 00:09:23,750 --> 00:09:25,776 You could also look at the history of chess. 193 00:09:25,776 --> 00:09:28,644 You could also look at who you're playing it against. 194 00:09:28,644 --> 00:09:29,905 Are you playing against a random person or 195 00:09:29,905 --> 00:09:31,540 against your dad? 196 00:09:31,540 --> 00:09:36,540 Big difference, or in my case my mom. 197 00:09:36,540 --> 00:09:39,580 Are you playing it in a club? 198 00:09:39,580 --> 00:09:45,527 Are you playing it against the chess master in Harvard Square 199 00:09:45,527 --> 00:09:48,270 or something like that? 200 00:09:48,270 --> 00:09:50,530 What does this game mean? 201 00:09:50,530 --> 00:09:53,280 Are you using the game metaphorically in speech? 202 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:02,820 My opponent wasn't checking his position. 203 00:10:02,820 --> 00:10:06,864 Doesn't necessarily mean that you were playing chess with 204 00:10:06,864 --> 00:10:09,920 someone else in order to get your point across. 205 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,100 There's a whole range of different ways that you can 206 00:10:12,100 --> 00:10:15,058 look at games, even as a game designer, that isn't 207 00:10:15,058 --> 00:10:16,537 specifically formalist. 208 00:10:16,537 --> 00:10:17,851 That isn't specifically just looking at 209 00:10:17,851 --> 00:10:20,481 the form of the game. 210 00:10:20,481 --> 00:10:22,822 Just understanding what context people are going to be 211 00:10:22,822 --> 00:10:25,090 playing the game in. 212 00:10:25,090 --> 00:10:27,090 While a lot of the games that you guys are going to be 213 00:10:27,090 --> 00:10:30,830 designing this semester, specifically in this class, 214 00:10:30,830 --> 00:10:32,890 you have to think about the fact that a lot of these games 215 00:10:32,890 --> 00:10:37,572 are actually going to be played by your instructors. 216 00:10:37,572 --> 00:10:39,840 Are going to be played in a setting very similar to this 217 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:41,090 by your colleagues. 218 00:10:43,530 --> 00:10:47,312 Are probably going to end up being tested by dorm mates, 219 00:10:47,312 --> 00:10:51,420 fraternity friends, folks around campus. 220 00:10:51,420 --> 00:10:54,066 And all that is going to vividly influence the kind of 221 00:10:54,066 --> 00:10:55,316 game that you make. 222 00:10:57,970 --> 00:11:01,680 For better or worse, you are pretty much making a game for 223 00:11:01,680 --> 00:11:03,110 an MIT audience. 224 00:11:03,110 --> 00:11:05,680 I am trying to change that a little bit for the last 225 00:11:05,680 --> 00:11:06,570 assignment. 226 00:11:06,570 --> 00:11:11,910 But keep in mind that's not necessarily every single game 227 00:11:11,910 --> 00:11:13,560 that you're going to make in the future. 228 00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:14,960 And that shouldn't be. 229 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:18,443 But, knowing that, you can try to cater to the audience that 230 00:11:18,443 --> 00:11:19,693 you've got. 231 00:11:23,163 --> 00:11:25,350 That has very little, in some ways, this is going to effect 232 00:11:25,350 --> 00:11:27,610 the design decisions that you make in your game. 233 00:11:27,610 --> 00:11:32,515 What will be perfectly acceptable to a competitive 234 00:11:32,515 --> 00:11:36,600 MIT audience might not be perfectly acceptable to your 235 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:38,860 average working buyer in Target or something like that. 236 00:11:42,260 --> 00:11:46,440 And so what may be a perfectly engrossing game, mechanic, 237 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,510 dynamic, aesthetic experience, that you will get. 238 00:11:49,510 --> 00:11:52,960 But just like looking at the formal aspects of one game, 239 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:56,280 this will be really cool if you understood the mechanic, 240 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:59,790 played it out in the way the creator designed the dynamic 241 00:11:59,790 --> 00:12:02,620 to give you the aesthetic experience. 242 00:12:02,620 --> 00:12:05,370 But if you don't have the standard context when you're 243 00:12:05,370 --> 00:12:08,846 playing the game, as an example, then your player may 244 00:12:08,846 --> 00:12:10,030 not even get that far. 245 00:12:10,030 --> 00:12:12,870 Your player may look at your game and say this game is not 246 00:12:12,870 --> 00:12:17,230 for me and just walk away. 247 00:12:17,230 --> 00:12:21,330 It might mean that you might-- 248 00:12:21,330 --> 00:12:24,393 I'm thinking of things like we just had this good discussion 249 00:12:24,393 --> 00:12:25,866 over lunch about the sort of games that you find on 250 00:12:25,866 --> 00:12:29,315 Facebook for instance. 251 00:12:29,315 --> 00:12:32,442 And a lot of social games-- 252 00:12:32,442 --> 00:12:34,738 I might have already made this point, but it has been argued 253 00:12:34,738 --> 00:12:36,870 that social games aren't all that social. 254 00:12:36,870 --> 00:12:39,822 All you do is really beg and scam your friends. 255 00:12:39,822 --> 00:12:42,010 That's the whole point-- 256 00:12:42,010 --> 00:12:46,135 In many ways, it's also the same to your friends who are 257 00:12:46,135 --> 00:12:47,110 doing the same thing. 258 00:12:47,110 --> 00:12:49,280 And we may be separated by time, and separated by 259 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:51,520 distance, we're all doing the same thing. 260 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:55,380 And we could be playing this game, we could be talking 261 00:12:55,380 --> 00:13:00,384 about a show that we are watching in our apartments and 262 00:13:00,384 --> 00:13:04,790 get to discuss it, but in many ways this is just me telling 263 00:13:04,790 --> 00:13:07,062 you we're doing the same thing, that we're part of the 264 00:13:07,062 --> 00:13:08,450 same group. 265 00:13:08,450 --> 00:13:12,024 And that serves a function that has almost, that really 266 00:13:12,024 --> 00:13:14,820 doesn't have anything to do with the formal analysis of 267 00:13:14,820 --> 00:13:19,380 how a game mechanic works, but it's still incredibly crucial 268 00:13:19,380 --> 00:13:23,570 to the popularity of those games. 269 00:13:23,570 --> 00:13:27,180 So keep that in mind, that even though 270 00:13:27,180 --> 00:13:28,210 Church makes his point-- 271 00:13:28,210 --> 00:13:32,549 I think a lot of designers actually ignore that when you 272 00:13:32,549 --> 00:13:34,140 read his essay-- 273 00:13:34,140 --> 00:13:35,980 that it's only one set of tools. 274 00:13:35,980 --> 00:13:40,060 The formal tools are only one set of tools, even. 275 00:13:40,060 --> 00:13:49,370 That our tools at looking at games culturally, personally, 276 00:13:49,370 --> 00:13:54,170 and other things that video games cast into light-- 277 00:13:56,930 --> 00:14:01,300 that will effect how people experience a game and how much 278 00:14:01,300 --> 00:14:01,870 pleasure they're going to get out of a game. 279 00:14:01,870 --> 00:14:04,200 To understand video games doing what it does right? 280 00:14:08,310 --> 00:14:11,520 That aren't, that don't have anything to do, necessarily, 281 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:12,934 with just by looking at the self-contained 282 00:14:12,934 --> 00:14:14,184 system of the game. 283 00:14:18,510 --> 00:14:22,370 Just as a side note, how many of you folks have heard of the 284 00:14:22,370 --> 00:14:27,182 narrative versus ludology debate? 285 00:14:27,182 --> 00:14:28,432 How many of you are sick of this? 286 00:14:32,594 --> 00:14:33,508 I'm sick of it too. 287 00:14:33,508 --> 00:14:36,140 But I bring it up for one reason, there is an 288 00:14:36,140 --> 00:14:40,250 interesting case that if you actually look at narratology 289 00:14:40,250 --> 00:14:44,390 as a study and ludology as a study, they're 290 00:14:44,390 --> 00:14:46,370 both formalist studies. 291 00:14:46,370 --> 00:14:48,820 In fact, they're more accurate more precisely, they're both 292 00:14:48,820 --> 00:14:51,658 structuralist. 293 00:14:51,658 --> 00:14:55,060 If you look at philosophies as a sub-sect of formalism, or at 294 00:14:55,060 --> 00:14:59,220 least a more recent version of it, they're both basically 295 00:14:59,220 --> 00:15:03,300 focused on these are the elements of this art form. 296 00:15:03,300 --> 00:15:05,120 And this is how they interact to produce 297 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,570 some sort of effect. 298 00:15:07,570 --> 00:15:11,890 And all that matters is what's contained in this art form. 299 00:15:11,890 --> 00:15:13,770 What's outside this art form doesn't matter. 300 00:15:13,770 --> 00:15:15,680 That's what narratology does for stories. 301 00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:19,000 That's what ludology does for games. 302 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:22,340 That's, in fact, probably why most people who study games 303 00:15:22,340 --> 00:15:26,616 have walked away from ludology because it's not that 304 00:15:26,616 --> 00:15:26,840 interesting. 305 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:28,490 You just study what's inside a system. 306 00:15:28,490 --> 00:15:29,740 People want to see what's outside. 307 00:15:31,580 --> 00:15:34,620 And so when you compare structuralistic and 308 00:15:34,620 --> 00:15:39,690 structuralism wins that's one case. 309 00:15:39,690 --> 00:15:44,160 And you only have, you may not realize that you're actually 310 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,090 looking at your game through a very, very, narrow lens. 311 00:15:47,090 --> 00:15:48,670 So I'm trying to broaden the range of 312 00:15:48,670 --> 00:15:49,884 tools that you've got. 313 00:15:49,884 --> 00:15:52,630 This class is going to give you a small set of them. 314 00:15:52,630 --> 00:15:57,020 And it's not by any means the be all and end all of every 315 00:15:57,020 --> 00:16:01,150 single way and that you can look at a game. 316 00:16:01,150 --> 00:16:04,310 And again, you're not just restricted to the tools that I 317 00:16:04,310 --> 00:16:06,700 specifically teach you in this class. 318 00:16:06,700 --> 00:16:10,921 So keep looking out for all the new ones. 319 00:16:10,921 --> 00:16:12,171 Let's see. 320 00:16:14,190 --> 00:16:15,640 Any questions so far? 321 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:16,890 That was my rant. 322 00:16:22,416 --> 00:16:25,330 OK, no more ranting. 323 00:16:25,330 --> 00:16:29,720 We have an activity. 324 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,660 Do you want to run through? 325 00:16:32,660 --> 00:16:36,544 GUEST SPEAKER: OK I'm going to pass around-- this is my 326 00:16:36,544 --> 00:16:37,978 crappy race game. 327 00:16:37,978 --> 00:16:42,182 So you're going to be getting one copy per pair. 328 00:16:42,182 --> 00:16:45,165 There's also some nifty set of dice. 329 00:16:45,165 --> 00:16:47,640 You'll need one copy per, one die per. 330 00:16:54,570 --> 00:16:56,776 And then, each person's going to need three 331 00:16:56,776 --> 00:16:59,050 of these poker chips. 332 00:16:59,050 --> 00:17:00,792 It doesn't matter the color so just grab three. 333 00:17:08,157 --> 00:17:10,612 You're each going to need a marker to indicate yourself. 334 00:17:10,612 --> 00:17:13,558 And I recommend just grabbing any given value-- 335 00:17:21,414 --> 00:17:22,887 There should be more than enough copies. 336 00:17:31,860 --> 00:17:33,110 So you only need one board per group. 337 00:17:44,379 --> 00:17:47,432 PROFESSOR: So one die for every two people? 338 00:17:47,432 --> 00:17:48,800 GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, one of those six-sided 339 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:50,170 die for every two. 340 00:17:50,170 --> 00:17:51,960 And then you need markers for yourselves 341 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:53,065 and then bonus markers. 342 00:17:53,065 --> 00:17:56,830 And that's what the poker chips are for. 343 00:17:56,830 --> 00:17:58,640 So keep the poker chips circulating. 344 00:17:58,640 --> 00:17:59,120 AUDIENCE: Three per person? 345 00:17:59,120 --> 00:17:59,920 GUEST SPEAKER: Three per person. 346 00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:02,800 AUDIENCE: One playing piece per person. 347 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:04,892 GUEST SPEAKER: You can use coins, you can use die-- 348 00:18:04,892 --> 00:18:06,940 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 349 00:18:06,940 --> 00:18:08,190 paper, whatever you want. 350 00:18:17,070 --> 00:18:19,410 PROFESSOR: So we have three of the important questions 351 00:18:19,410 --> 00:18:20,660 [INAUDIBLE]. 352 00:18:26,940 --> 00:18:28,240 AUDIENCE: How many [INAUDIBLE] take back? 353 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:30,050 GUEST SPEAKER: If you need markers for yourself, you can 354 00:18:30,050 --> 00:18:33,724 try one of the multi-sided polyhedral dice over here. 355 00:18:33,724 --> 00:18:34,678 I guess-- 356 00:18:34,678 --> 00:18:37,270 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 357 00:18:37,270 --> 00:18:38,520 AUDIENCE: OK, OK, what now? 358 00:18:45,715 --> 00:18:46,705 GUEST SPEAKER: I'm more well-versed in the-- 359 00:18:46,705 --> 00:19:04,544 GUEST SPEAKER: The die is to roll 360 00:19:04,544 --> 00:19:06,360 GUEST SPEAKER: OK, so can everyone hold on for a second? 361 00:19:06,360 --> 00:19:08,190 So what we're going to ask you to do is just play through 362 00:19:08,190 --> 00:19:09,690 this game a couple times? 363 00:19:09,690 --> 00:19:13,030 Then we're going to come back and apply the MDA framework to 364 00:19:13,030 --> 00:19:13,860 the game itself. 365 00:19:13,860 --> 00:19:15,510 And then if we have time, I think we're going to spend 366 00:19:15,510 --> 00:19:17,890 some time tweaking it? 367 00:19:17,890 --> 00:19:18,890 OK, cool. 368 00:19:18,890 --> 00:19:20,140 So we'll interrupt you guys-- 369 00:19:24,238 --> 00:19:25,729 actually, ten minutes probably. 370 00:19:25,729 --> 00:19:26,979 It's a pretty quick game. 371 00:19:30,815 --> 00:19:32,960 This has sort of gone flat. 372 00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:35,560 So what we'd kind of like to do is hear about-- 373 00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:36,862 I guess we'll just go around the room in pairs 374 00:19:36,862 --> 00:19:38,140 and ask you to talk. 375 00:19:38,140 --> 00:19:41,680 Or do you want a minute to talk, to apply MDA to this and 376 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:43,030 focus on some things? 377 00:19:43,030 --> 00:19:45,340 So I'm not like calling anyone on the spot. 378 00:19:45,340 --> 00:19:47,810 PROFESSOR: Anybody want to volunteer what, how they felt? 379 00:19:47,810 --> 00:19:49,846 What was the aesthetic of this game? 380 00:19:49,846 --> 00:19:51,096 AUDIENCE: There is none. 381 00:19:54,666 --> 00:19:57,880 GUEST SPEAKER: There's no emotional affect. 382 00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,455 PROFESSOR: It felt competitive. 383 00:19:59,455 --> 00:20:02,070 AUDIENCE: The thing is, it's a very simple aesthetic. 384 00:20:02,070 --> 00:20:05,060 So in the paper they say you're going to the pleasure 385 00:20:05,060 --> 00:20:07,163 of using the aesthetic, but here you go straight to the 386 00:20:07,163 --> 00:20:08,413 mechanic and you're wondering about it. 387 00:20:11,620 --> 00:20:14,204 PROFESSOR: You, it definitely is easy especially because 388 00:20:14,204 --> 00:20:16,413 especially for board games the mechanics are written down 389 00:20:16,413 --> 00:20:17,772 right in front of you, it's really easy 390 00:20:17,772 --> 00:20:18,680 when you look at that. 391 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:21,746 But how did you feel while you were playing this game? 392 00:20:21,746 --> 00:20:23,940 AUDIENCE: There was a sense of tension. 393 00:20:23,940 --> 00:20:29,264 There was maybe a sense of [INAUDIBLE] perhaps? 394 00:20:29,264 --> 00:20:30,480 There was a sense of-- 395 00:20:30,480 --> 00:20:38,470 I mean there was the intellectual challenge of 396 00:20:38,470 --> 00:20:40,440 working out is there really a meaningful 397 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:41,690 decision to be made here? 398 00:20:44,358 --> 00:20:47,775 And if there is, what is the correct decision? 399 00:20:51,220 --> 00:20:56,595 PROFESSOR: So thinking can I optimize this? 400 00:20:56,595 --> 00:20:59,553 Especially with this crowd, I think there was an immediate 401 00:20:59,553 --> 00:21:03,497 try to figure out what the right thing is. 402 00:21:03,497 --> 00:21:06,340 And I know you were trying to figure it out. 403 00:21:06,340 --> 00:21:10,300 AUDIENCE: I think he correctly figured it out. 404 00:21:10,300 --> 00:21:12,540 PROFESSOR: So is there an optimal way to play this game? 405 00:21:12,540 --> 00:21:16,800 AUDIENCE: Yeah, OK, so if you're losing-- 406 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:18,440 If you keep putting tokens down you're 407 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:19,330 going to lose anyway. 408 00:21:19,330 --> 00:21:21,080 So you want to be rolling in order to 409 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:24,040 increase the variance. 410 00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:27,541 And if you're winning, you want to be putting tokens down 411 00:21:27,541 --> 00:21:29,155 in order to move the variance. 412 00:21:29,155 --> 00:21:30,700 You can imagine if it's like a distribution. 413 00:21:34,190 --> 00:21:37,625 If you're below the winning line you want to widen it out 414 00:21:37,625 --> 00:21:40,071 as much as possible so as much of that distribution is above 415 00:21:40,071 --> 00:21:41,810 the winning line. 416 00:21:41,810 --> 00:21:42,825 And if you're above the winning line you want it to be 417 00:21:42,825 --> 00:21:44,660 as narrow as possible so you stay above the winning line. 418 00:21:44,660 --> 00:21:47,080 PROFESSOR: So your strategy is basically based on what's the 419 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:48,050 currency of the game. 420 00:21:48,050 --> 00:21:50,910 AUDIENCE: Yeah, until the last turn where obviously you don't 421 00:21:50,910 --> 00:21:52,160 want to put a token down if you're two from the end. 422 00:21:54,770 --> 00:21:59,090 As long as no one can win on this turn, if I'm behind him 423 00:21:59,090 --> 00:22:01,734 I'm rolling the die. 424 00:22:01,734 --> 00:22:04,532 And if I'm ahead of him I'm putting down a token. 425 00:22:04,532 --> 00:22:07,750 GUEST SPEAKER: Did anyone prefer a strategy before you 426 00:22:07,750 --> 00:22:10,232 started thinking about what was the best one? 427 00:22:10,232 --> 00:22:11,708 AUDIENCE: I'm too lazy to use the tokens 428 00:22:11,708 --> 00:22:15,020 so I just keep rolling. 429 00:22:15,020 --> 00:22:17,178 GUEST SPEAKER: And that's also part of the 430 00:22:17,178 --> 00:22:18,582 aesthetic of it right? 431 00:22:18,582 --> 00:22:20,460 You just happen to prefer the die roll. 432 00:22:20,460 --> 00:22:22,680 AUDIENCE: On the first three spaces you should be getting 433 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:24,748 the average if you roll [INAUDIBLE] 434 00:22:24,748 --> 00:22:25,732 if you put a token down. 435 00:22:25,732 --> 00:22:27,208 I personally like being conservative. 436 00:22:27,208 --> 00:22:28,684 PROFESSOR: You win no matter what. 437 00:22:31,634 --> 00:22:32,116 GUEST SPEAKER: I'm sorry what? 438 00:22:32,116 --> 00:22:33,080 AUDIENCE: That's more exciting because it 439 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,972 does different things. 440 00:22:35,972 --> 00:22:36,936 AUDIENCE: The token gives you the illusion that you're 441 00:22:36,936 --> 00:22:38,186 actually playing. 442 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:44,680 PROFESSOR: Did anyone like get in the situation where they 443 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:46,490 are really far behind in a different color? 444 00:22:46,490 --> 00:22:47,740 AUDIENCE: No. 445 00:22:58,400 --> 00:22:59,810 PROFESSOR: The actual difference-- 446 00:22:59,810 --> 00:23:03,590 one of the things that you do get in this game is the 447 00:23:03,590 --> 00:23:06,530 perceived distance between players. 448 00:23:06,530 --> 00:23:10,872 It's actually not that far. 449 00:23:10,872 --> 00:23:14,580 If the one behind actually has to still get in. 450 00:23:14,580 --> 00:23:17,010 I think people refer to this as the 451 00:23:17,010 --> 00:23:18,520 American Gladiators effect. 452 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:22,020 You know how, American Gladiators-- 453 00:23:22,020 --> 00:23:24,700 actually, is this your example that I'm stealing? 454 00:23:24,700 --> 00:23:26,600 GUEST SPEAKER: I don't remember, honestly. 455 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:28,090 PROFESSOR: Someone I can't help from stealing. 456 00:23:28,090 --> 00:23:30,110 GUEST SPEAKER: I think it's in the book at some point, but I 457 00:23:30,110 --> 00:23:31,380 think we had applied it to this. 458 00:23:31,380 --> 00:23:32,766 AUDIENCE: Plagiarism! 459 00:23:32,766 --> 00:23:34,490 PROFESSOR: Yes, yes, well I'm crediting 460 00:23:34,490 --> 00:23:35,960 someone for this question. 461 00:23:41,020 --> 00:23:42,270 Citation needed. 462 00:23:44,490 --> 00:23:48,250 The basic idea being-- 463 00:23:48,250 --> 00:23:51,880 who's seen American Gladiators? 464 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:53,788 GUEST SPEAKER: They might be too old. 465 00:23:53,788 --> 00:23:55,610 AUDIENCE: No, no, we had American Gladiators. 466 00:23:55,610 --> 00:23:56,220 AUDIENCE: I've never-- 467 00:23:56,220 --> 00:23:57,772 I don't know what it is. 468 00:23:57,772 --> 00:24:00,445 PROFESSOR: OK, there are also a number of Japanese game 469 00:24:00,445 --> 00:24:02,146 shows which are similar to this. 470 00:24:05,116 --> 00:24:07,920 The basic idea of American Gladiators is that it's 471 00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:09,537 basically an obstacle course where the 472 00:24:09,537 --> 00:24:11,930 obstacles are people. 473 00:24:11,930 --> 00:24:17,940 Happen to be these athletic dudes and women who are either 474 00:24:17,940 --> 00:24:20,603 pummeling you with waffle sticks or shooting tennis 475 00:24:20,603 --> 00:24:23,436 balls at you out of a gun and stuff like that. 476 00:24:23,436 --> 00:24:25,740 And you basically have to get from the beginning to the end 477 00:24:25,740 --> 00:24:27,710 faster than the other team. 478 00:24:27,710 --> 00:24:29,310 Actually, faster than the other player. 479 00:24:29,310 --> 00:24:32,080 So it's two regular dudes and a whole bunch of athletes who 480 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:33,330 are throwing things at you. 481 00:24:35,380 --> 00:24:37,800 Every time you get hit you have to go back a little bit. 482 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:42,540 But the thing about American Gladiators is that you have 483 00:24:42,540 --> 00:24:44,506 this long obstacle course. 484 00:24:44,506 --> 00:24:45,550 In fact, this was one of the events. 485 00:24:45,550 --> 00:24:49,910 This was always the final event of the entire TV show. 486 00:24:49,910 --> 00:24:54,310 Is that, you will have two people doing the same course. 487 00:24:54,310 --> 00:24:56,470 They will have to climb up a wall and then they will have 488 00:24:56,470 --> 00:25:02,260 to go down a zip line. 489 00:25:02,260 --> 00:25:04,600 GUEST SPEAKER: But it was a cargo net specifically. 490 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:05,960 So it was really difficult to climb up it. 491 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,990 PROFESSOR: Yeah, the big webbing kind of thing. 492 00:25:09,990 --> 00:25:11,610 It was like climbing the rigging off a ship. 493 00:25:11,610 --> 00:25:15,990 It was really, really, difficult. 494 00:25:15,990 --> 00:25:19,840 So what happens is that if you have two people who are 495 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:20,690 really, really, far apart-- 496 00:25:20,690 --> 00:25:22,500 one person is way ahead-- 497 00:25:22,500 --> 00:25:24,700 and that person starts climbing the cargo net? 498 00:25:24,700 --> 00:25:26,795 It takes that person forever to get to the end of the cargo 499 00:25:26,795 --> 00:25:29,294 net, because climbing up cargo net is really, really, hard no 500 00:25:29,294 --> 00:25:30,340 matter who you are. 501 00:25:30,340 --> 00:25:34,390 That gives the person behind plenty of time to catch up and 502 00:25:34,390 --> 00:25:36,510 start climbing the cargo net. 503 00:25:36,510 --> 00:25:40,000 But then, the person who was the leader in the first place 504 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:40,765 hits the zip line. 505 00:25:40,765 --> 00:25:44,220 And all of a sudden there's a huge increase in distance. 506 00:25:44,220 --> 00:25:47,205 So this whole idea that they never really 507 00:25:47,205 --> 00:25:49,890 were all that far-- 508 00:25:49,890 --> 00:25:51,340 they never really changed their position. 509 00:25:51,340 --> 00:25:56,800 For most Gladiators games the winner has already been 510 00:25:56,800 --> 00:25:58,110 decided by their points. 511 00:25:58,110 --> 00:26:01,240 Because the first person who reaches the cargo net tends to 512 00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:02,780 win the match. 513 00:26:02,780 --> 00:26:06,950 But it looks like the lead just shrank because suddenly 514 00:26:06,950 --> 00:26:10,270 you've got both of them in one camera shot. 515 00:26:10,270 --> 00:26:13,140 And then you've got that cute-- 516 00:26:13,140 --> 00:26:15,280 mom likes to call that dramatic tension. 517 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,790 Which I think is a better description than it's other 518 00:26:17,790 --> 00:26:19,330 term for the same thing which is drama. 519 00:26:19,330 --> 00:26:20,320 Because it's not drama. 520 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:21,570 It' s just tension really. 521 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:25,290 But that's an aesthetic. 522 00:26:25,290 --> 00:26:28,290 You're going for the aesthetic of tension and coming up with 523 00:26:28,290 --> 00:26:31,250 a game that makes you feel like the fight is closer than 524 00:26:31,250 --> 00:26:32,650 it actually is. 525 00:26:32,650 --> 00:26:38,630 Or allowing someone to close the gap quickly because, many 526 00:26:38,630 --> 00:26:41,690 of you have pointed about, these things probabilistically 527 00:26:41,690 --> 00:26:43,040 mean exactly the same thing as a die roll. 528 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:46,810 Let's see. 529 00:26:49,660 --> 00:26:56,520 But the ability to increase a awkward gap to open up and 530 00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:59,410 then to close, that's actually a dynamic. 531 00:26:59,410 --> 00:27:02,410 That's actually a result of a number of different rules that 532 00:27:02,410 --> 00:27:05,480 are in the particular of the game. 533 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,810 It's not written down that it's going to happen. 534 00:27:07,810 --> 00:27:10,505 But it's pretty much going to happen if you have two people 535 00:27:10,505 --> 00:27:13,112 playing those particular strategies, and one thing that 536 00:27:13,112 --> 00:27:14,362 happens pretty often. 537 00:27:22,850 --> 00:27:27,200 What are the constraints that you're seeing in the design of 538 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,450 this game here? 539 00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:35,484 What did this game have to do in order for it to be a viable 540 00:27:35,484 --> 00:27:35,967 in-class exercise? 541 00:27:35,967 --> 00:27:37,899 AUDIENCE: Fit on a sheet of paper. 542 00:27:37,899 --> 00:27:39,831 PROFESSOR: Fit on a sheet of paper. 543 00:27:39,831 --> 00:27:41,210 That's a huge one actually. 544 00:27:41,210 --> 00:27:42,410 Because first of all, it limits how many 545 00:27:42,410 --> 00:27:44,590 spaces you've got. 546 00:27:44,590 --> 00:27:47,130 Assuming everyone's using something like a die or a coin 547 00:27:47,130 --> 00:27:49,540 or something. 548 00:27:49,540 --> 00:27:51,950 GUEST SPEAKER: I mean, you can laugh at that but it's 549 00:27:51,950 --> 00:27:53,930 literally how it went. 550 00:27:53,930 --> 00:27:56,450 I wanted it to fit on a sheet of paper and the spaces had to 551 00:27:56,450 --> 00:27:58,000 accommodate a die. 552 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,430 So the number of spaces is a result of that. 553 00:28:01,430 --> 00:28:02,902 AUDIENCE: It was almost like an accident. 554 00:28:06,830 --> 00:28:08,410 PROFESSOR: Well you probably could have fit a few more 555 00:28:08,410 --> 00:28:09,725 squares in there. 556 00:28:09,725 --> 00:28:11,697 GUEST SPEAKER: Probably, but you place some margins. 557 00:28:11,697 --> 00:28:12,947 PROFESSOR: Yeah. 558 00:28:15,641 --> 00:28:16,873 AUDIENCE: The rules have to fit on one 559 00:28:16,873 --> 00:28:18,120 sheet of paper as well. 560 00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:20,260 So the rules can't be that complicated. 561 00:28:20,260 --> 00:28:22,812 PROFESSOR: Most of these rules are single sentences for the 562 00:28:22,812 --> 00:28:26,060 most part, because we are more than [INAUDIBLE]. 563 00:28:30,963 --> 00:28:32,248 It had to be quick. 564 00:28:32,248 --> 00:28:34,538 It had to work within 10 minutes. 565 00:28:34,538 --> 00:28:36,590 In fact, it had to work so you get through a few games within 566 00:28:36,590 --> 00:28:39,075 10 minutes. 567 00:28:39,075 --> 00:28:40,325 Anyone only manage to get through one? 568 00:28:43,051 --> 00:28:44,301 AUDIENCE: That'd be really hard. 569 00:28:53,270 --> 00:28:56,930 PROFESSOR: So different aesthetics. 570 00:28:56,930 --> 00:29:01,490 So, this game tries to get really, really, tense. 571 00:29:01,490 --> 00:29:04,436 But obviously, the decisions that you're actually making in 572 00:29:04,436 --> 00:29:07,840 this game is minimal. 573 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:12,880 You get to say, well if you are already losing, that has 574 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:14,680 [INAUDIBLE]. 575 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:15,870 One rational thing to do. 576 00:29:15,870 --> 00:29:19,935 But if you were playing this game, as Jason recommended, if 577 00:29:19,935 --> 00:29:22,198 I were playing this game against myself there really is 578 00:29:22,198 --> 00:29:23,325 no optimal strategy. 579 00:29:23,325 --> 00:29:26,223 I could pick two different strategies for each side. 580 00:29:26,223 --> 00:29:27,990 AUDIENCE: It's whoever plays first basically. 581 00:29:27,990 --> 00:29:30,210 Whoever plays first is by default going to win. 582 00:29:30,210 --> 00:29:31,460 PROFESSOR: On average. 583 00:29:34,650 --> 00:29:36,690 AUDIENCE: I won every game but one. 584 00:29:36,690 --> 00:29:38,740 I did bad rolling dice. 585 00:29:38,740 --> 00:29:40,020 GUEST SPEAKER: Because if you roll them now-- 586 00:29:42,610 --> 00:29:45,720 PROFESSOR: So I would like actually, folks to try mixing 587 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,060 this up a little bit. 588 00:29:47,060 --> 00:29:53,580 Pick a rule in here, any rule, and alter it. 589 00:29:53,580 --> 00:29:56,040 You can do things like adding more squares. 590 00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:57,340 You can change the movement chart. 591 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,750 One idea that I had, and someone was thinking probably 592 00:30:02,750 --> 00:30:06,750 more recent than me, which is what happens if you use the 593 00:30:06,750 --> 00:30:10,340 higher of two dice rolls instead of just one? 594 00:30:10,340 --> 00:30:11,940 [INAUDIBLE] to the probability. 595 00:30:11,940 --> 00:30:15,290 Play around with that. 596 00:30:15,290 --> 00:30:19,202 See what that feels like. 597 00:30:19,202 --> 00:30:23,650 And if that feels just boring try doing something else. 598 00:30:23,650 --> 00:30:28,140 So we've got 15 minutes? 599 00:30:28,140 --> 00:30:29,340 GUEST SPEAKER: Yeah, that's reasonable. 600 00:30:29,340 --> 00:30:32,870 PROFESSOR: And then, you'll tell the class about what you 601 00:30:32,870 --> 00:30:35,098 changed and how that changed the feeling of the game. 602 00:30:35,098 --> 00:30:38,080 Cool? 603 00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:42,420 So, every two people, work with a team. 604 00:30:42,420 --> 00:30:46,630 Explain how your game, how your version works, and have 605 00:30:46,630 --> 00:30:52,570 the other group play it and vice versa. 606 00:30:52,570 --> 00:30:58,663 And what we're going to do once everyone's done, you will 607 00:30:58,663 --> 00:31:03,460 tell the class what you felt the other 608 00:31:03,460 --> 00:31:04,910 group's game felt like. 609 00:31:04,910 --> 00:31:08,430 So let someone else figure out what your game aesthetic is. 610 00:31:08,430 --> 00:31:13,340 So, does any team want to just go first in describing the 611 00:31:13,340 --> 00:31:16,070 other team's game? 612 00:31:16,070 --> 00:31:18,065 OK, starting with you. 613 00:31:18,065 --> 00:31:19,425 AUDIENCE: Do you want us to describe 614 00:31:19,425 --> 00:31:20,700 the rules they changed? 615 00:31:20,700 --> 00:31:21,100 PROFESSOR: Uh, sure. 616 00:31:21,100 --> 00:31:23,130 AUDIENCE: Or just say-- 617 00:31:23,130 --> 00:31:26,520 the main change in this version was that it's modular. 618 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:28,340 So you have to land exactly on the end or 619 00:31:28,340 --> 00:31:29,630 otherwise you wrap around. 620 00:31:32,170 --> 00:31:35,010 It changed the aesthetic a lot because it stopped being a 621 00:31:35,010 --> 00:31:38,590 race against your opponent and became more of trying to 622 00:31:38,590 --> 00:31:41,630 figure out how you can use your tokens to precision just 623 00:31:41,630 --> 00:31:42,490 hit the end. 624 00:31:42,490 --> 00:31:43,770 PROFESSOR: Oh, OK. 625 00:31:43,770 --> 00:31:46,120 AUDIENCE: More methodical and thoughtful. 626 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:48,740 You decide whether or not you're going to stockpile 627 00:31:48,740 --> 00:31:51,360 tokens to give you more winning squares and then you 628 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,660 just waited until you landed on a winning square. 629 00:31:53,660 --> 00:31:54,960 PROFESSOR: So you get a dis-computational 630 00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:56,410 motive to the game? 631 00:31:56,410 --> 00:31:59,280 AUDIENCE: It was not as competitive. 632 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:01,270 AUDIENCE: So one of the discussions we had was, what 633 00:32:01,270 --> 00:32:03,070 if you had three tokens you could just get to the end. 634 00:32:03,070 --> 00:32:05,290 Because we made our tokens move four spaces. 635 00:32:05,290 --> 00:32:05,690 PROFESSOR: OK. 636 00:32:05,690 --> 00:32:07,154 AUDIENCE: But I just realized, you have to do the die roll 637 00:32:07,154 --> 00:32:08,130 after that. 638 00:32:08,130 --> 00:32:09,372 AUDIENCE: Yeah. 639 00:32:09,372 --> 00:32:10,900 AUDIENCE: Oh, yeah. 640 00:32:17,370 --> 00:32:20,090 AUDIENCE: They had a really creative role where 641 00:32:20,090 --> 00:32:22,790 they had a 10 here. 642 00:32:22,790 --> 00:32:24,940 So it goes from 0 to 9. 643 00:32:24,940 --> 00:32:27,670 And you roll under a cup and that's the number of spaces 644 00:32:27,670 --> 00:32:28,880 away from the end. 645 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:33,300 So from 0 to 9 that the winning point is. 646 00:32:33,300 --> 00:32:35,040 And at your turn you can either play normally or you 647 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:37,910 can check to see where the winning point is. 648 00:32:37,910 --> 00:32:41,010 If you've won, that triggers you winning. 649 00:32:41,010 --> 00:32:42,510 But you cannot win unless you physically check and confirm 650 00:32:42,510 --> 00:32:45,228 that you've won. 651 00:32:45,228 --> 00:32:49,195 So it eats up a turn, but it could be that after two rolls 652 00:32:49,195 --> 00:32:51,436 of two and this was a nine you've won. 653 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,150 And it was a lot of fun basically because we had to 654 00:32:56,150 --> 00:33:00,240 figure out the optimal strategy but it was just fun. 655 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,610 PROFESSOR: So what's it feel like when you're trying to 656 00:33:03,610 --> 00:33:05,310 figure out what you're going to do? 657 00:33:05,310 --> 00:33:07,840 AUDIENCE: He beat me by checking when it was far away 658 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,090 and being lucky. 659 00:33:13,230 --> 00:33:14,900 PROFESSOR: So if you don't check you have to reach the 660 00:33:14,900 --> 00:33:15,700 end to win. 661 00:33:15,700 --> 00:33:19,330 So you have to check, usually, anyway. 662 00:33:19,330 --> 00:33:21,290 AUDIENCE: One thing Alecia had in mind when we were thinking 663 00:33:21,290 --> 00:33:27,000 about the rule was there ought to be information that you can 664 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:28,902 get from how your opponent reacts after they 665 00:33:28,902 --> 00:33:31,130 look under the cup. 666 00:33:31,130 --> 00:33:33,220 So if they then go and start rolling again or what have 667 00:33:33,220 --> 00:33:36,880 you, or they then start options. 668 00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,880 But there must be some way that you can get a leak of 669 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:42,980 information from their behavior which makes it 670 00:33:42,980 --> 00:33:44,030 interesting in a different way. 671 00:33:44,030 --> 00:33:45,930 AUDIENCE: If you've have already seen the cup, and you 672 00:33:45,930 --> 00:33:50,000 get past the point, do you have to check to win? 673 00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:51,726 AUDIENCE: Yeah, we played two different variants. 674 00:33:51,726 --> 00:33:52,110 One where you did. 675 00:33:52,110 --> 00:33:52,600 One where you didn't. 676 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:53,840 AUDIENCE: Oh, I see. 677 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:55,280 AUDIENCE: Well, you don't have to check the second time. 678 00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:57,970 If you check the first time and then you pass it you win. 679 00:33:57,970 --> 00:34:00,220 AUDIENCE: So that's why there's one way of playing it. 680 00:34:00,220 --> 00:34:03,480 PROFESSOR: So the person who checks could win even they're 681 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:04,810 already passed the point? 682 00:34:04,810 --> 00:34:07,830 Am I understanding this right? 683 00:34:07,830 --> 00:34:09,820 AUDIENCE: Well, if he's the first past the point. 684 00:34:09,820 --> 00:34:14,324 If you don't have check to win, so if you just need the 685 00:34:14,324 --> 00:34:17,220 knowledge of what the endpoint is, then if he 686 00:34:17,220 --> 00:34:18,409 passes it first he wins. 687 00:34:18,409 --> 00:34:20,444 If when he checks both players are at that 688 00:34:20,444 --> 00:34:21,600 spot then it's a tie. 689 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:23,484 PROFESSOR: Oh, ok. 690 00:34:23,484 --> 00:34:25,239 AUDIENCE: But since it's a sequential game it's 691 00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:25,820 impossible. 692 00:34:25,820 --> 00:34:28,170 Other than, at the moment of the check if both players are 693 00:34:28,170 --> 00:34:29,723 at the same spot is it possible for them to win at 694 00:34:29,723 --> 00:34:30,313 the same time. 695 00:34:30,313 --> 00:34:32,250 So that's not really an issue. 696 00:34:32,250 --> 00:34:34,659 AUDIENCE: What if I check, and you're past me, and you have 697 00:34:34,659 --> 00:34:35,440 passed the check spot? 698 00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:36,565 AUDIENCE: I don't win. 699 00:34:36,565 --> 00:34:37,179 AUDIENCE: OK. 700 00:34:37,179 --> 00:34:38,110 AUDIENCE: Because I never checked. 701 00:34:38,110 --> 00:34:40,262 So as long as I don't know I don't win. 702 00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:44,790 PROFESSOR: Hey, he makes me think of a different variant. 703 00:34:44,790 --> 00:34:46,040 But OK. 704 00:34:48,420 --> 00:34:51,810 AUDIENCE: So what they did was they introduced 705 00:34:51,810 --> 00:34:52,560 a couple new rules. 706 00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:56,366 The first rule being that, the person who rolls first on 707 00:34:56,366 --> 00:34:59,100 their first turn they cannot put down a token. 708 00:34:59,100 --> 00:35:00,720 So they actually have to roll. 709 00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:04,730 The second rule is, whenever you roll if you have a bonus 710 00:35:04,730 --> 00:35:06,990 token on the stockpile you have two 711 00:35:06,990 --> 00:35:08,160 options after you roll. 712 00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:09,610 One is, you can take it off and move 713 00:35:09,610 --> 00:35:10,840 two spaces like normal. 714 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,030 The second is, you can choose to make that block impassible. 715 00:35:14,030 --> 00:35:17,640 So what this does is your opponent cannot 716 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:18,265 land on that block. 717 00:35:18,265 --> 00:35:21,095 If they are already on that block they get pushed one 718 00:35:21,095 --> 00:35:22,130 block back. 719 00:35:22,130 --> 00:35:25,040 If they are behind it, and they roll and they move to 720 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,460 that block, they get pushed one block behind it. 721 00:35:27,460 --> 00:35:28,763 PROFESSOR: So they're changing the block 722 00:35:28,763 --> 00:35:29,455 while you're playing. 723 00:35:29,455 --> 00:35:30,165 AUDIENCE: Yes. 724 00:35:30,165 --> 00:35:31,120 PROFESSOR: And how did that feel while you 725 00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:32,100 were actually playing? 726 00:35:32,100 --> 00:35:33,350 AUDIENCE: We didn't actually use it that much. 727 00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:41,245 AUDIENCE: I felt like the penalty for the impassable 728 00:35:41,245 --> 00:35:42,540 block should have been more. 729 00:35:42,540 --> 00:35:44,675 Because if you land on the block that they're on, and 730 00:35:44,675 --> 00:35:46,940 make them move back one, that token would otherwise have 731 00:35:46,940 --> 00:35:47,745 made you move forward two. 732 00:35:47,745 --> 00:35:51,040 So it doesn't really reward you for that. 733 00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,830 I felt it could have been really awesome if the penalty 734 00:35:53,830 --> 00:35:55,640 was significantly more severe. 735 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,800 Because it's hard to get in front of them enough to 736 00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:01,945 actually make a block impassable and have them land 737 00:36:01,945 --> 00:36:04,710 on it later. 738 00:36:04,710 --> 00:36:05,470 AUDIENCE: Probably to all the way back or something. 739 00:36:05,470 --> 00:36:07,240 AUDIENCE: Yeah exactly. 740 00:36:07,240 --> 00:36:08,550 PROFESSOR: So try multiplying it by two 741 00:36:08,550 --> 00:36:09,800 and see what happens. 742 00:36:17,706 --> 00:36:21,650 AUDIENCE: Yeah, and then you can always go land on it. 743 00:36:21,650 --> 00:36:23,570 PROFESSOR: If you're like, hmm, that should have changed 744 00:36:23,570 --> 00:36:24,820 the game play but that didn't. 745 00:36:27,410 --> 00:36:31,020 One of the tricks in chapter one was just make it bigger 746 00:36:31,020 --> 00:36:32,090 and see what happens. 747 00:36:32,090 --> 00:36:35,170 If nothing else it will just give you more information on 748 00:36:35,170 --> 00:36:36,430 whether you should be spending any more 749 00:36:36,430 --> 00:36:39,390 time with this direction. 750 00:36:39,390 --> 00:36:43,373 Or whether it really isn't going to affect the way how 751 00:36:43,373 --> 00:36:45,510 people play because people don't end up caring about it. 752 00:36:45,510 --> 00:36:48,916 So the rule of twos is just multiply something by two, or 753 00:36:48,916 --> 00:36:50,807 half it by two, and see what happens. 754 00:36:50,807 --> 00:36:54,390 Obviously halving by two would not in this work. 755 00:36:54,390 --> 00:36:56,720 Who else? 756 00:36:56,720 --> 00:36:59,660 AUDIENCE: So actually they had these tokens as power-ups. 757 00:36:59,660 --> 00:37:01,200 And you would never actually take them off 758 00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:02,530 to move more spaces. 759 00:37:02,530 --> 00:37:05,400 You would just keep adding tokens and you could roll. 760 00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:09,570 So you can spend one turn to put a token on and in 761 00:37:09,570 --> 00:37:13,120 consequent rolls you could essentially say, I have N 762 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:18,830 tokens therefore I roll N plus 1 dice and subtract N. 763 00:37:18,830 --> 00:37:20,080 PROFESSOR: I think that's one dice. 764 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:24,050 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 765 00:37:24,050 --> 00:37:26,690 AUDIENCE: --and then you roll a die for each token you have, 766 00:37:26,690 --> 00:37:29,740 and then you move back one space for each token you have. 767 00:37:29,740 --> 00:37:30,500 PROFESSOR: Interesting. 768 00:37:30,500 --> 00:37:31,300 AUDIENCE: So it moves your average and your 769 00:37:31,300 --> 00:37:33,091 maximum up each time. 770 00:37:33,091 --> 00:37:35,130 AUDIENCE: So you could act it as a power yourself up. 771 00:37:35,130 --> 00:37:37,880 AUDIENCE: And you could also remove tokens to take away 772 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:39,512 tokens from the other guy, right? 773 00:37:39,512 --> 00:37:41,074 AUDIENCE: Yeah. 774 00:37:41,074 --> 00:37:42,550 AUDIENCE: Which we never actually did. 775 00:37:46,540 --> 00:37:49,835 AUDIENCE: I guess we forgot to go into that, you don't take 776 00:37:49,835 --> 00:37:52,190 out all the tokens when you do your special move. 777 00:37:52,190 --> 00:37:53,870 They stay in there. 778 00:37:53,870 --> 00:37:55,670 Because, mathematically speaking if you take them off 779 00:37:55,670 --> 00:37:58,860 it makes it worse. 780 00:37:58,860 --> 00:38:03,823 PROFESSOR: So, I mean, that's an important object lesson in 781 00:38:03,823 --> 00:38:06,520 how to explain the rules to the people. 782 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:08,950 How'd it feel while you were playing their version? 783 00:38:08,950 --> 00:38:13,755 AUDIENCE: It made my mind tired, being N plus 1 minus N. 784 00:38:13,755 --> 00:38:15,240 But, it was interesting. 785 00:38:15,240 --> 00:38:16,080 I actually used it. 786 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,530 Before I said I would only use the die, but this time I 787 00:38:18,530 --> 00:38:19,100 actually used tokens. 788 00:38:19,100 --> 00:38:20,000 PROFESSOR: And what happened when you 789 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:21,080 actually used the token? 790 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,394 Was it like yes! 791 00:38:23,394 --> 00:38:27,870 AUDIENCE: Like I said, the math made it too hard. 792 00:38:27,870 --> 00:38:30,110 PROFESSOR: Well something happened. 793 00:38:30,110 --> 00:38:33,940 It made you use the tokens as opposed to ignoring them. 794 00:38:33,940 --> 00:38:35,190 AUDIENCE: It was interesting. 795 00:38:39,070 --> 00:38:42,500 AUDIENCE: So, the rule that they gave was that if you are 796 00:38:42,500 --> 00:38:43,820 behind the player-- 797 00:38:43,820 --> 00:38:50,580 by behind, they mean if your piece is behind the other one. 798 00:38:50,580 --> 00:38:51,663 AUDIENCE: Losing, in second place. 799 00:38:51,663 --> 00:38:56,100 AUDIENCE: Right, but not in the imaginary sense. 800 00:38:56,100 --> 00:38:57,350 Well, whatever. 801 00:39:00,044 --> 00:39:03,320 If you're physically behind them then when you use a token 802 00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:05,270 you get to use one extra space ahead. 803 00:39:05,270 --> 00:39:09,226 PROFESSOR: OK, if you use two tokens do you end up getting? 804 00:39:09,226 --> 00:39:10,590 AUDIENCE: It's still one space. 805 00:39:10,590 --> 00:39:12,380 PROFESSOR: So how did that feel? 806 00:39:12,380 --> 00:39:14,970 AUDIENCE: It actually changed the strategy a little bit 807 00:39:14,970 --> 00:39:16,590 because in the beginning you basically don't want to be the 808 00:39:16,590 --> 00:39:18,027 person that moves first. 809 00:39:18,027 --> 00:39:21,010 Because then your opponent can just use all their tokens and 810 00:39:21,010 --> 00:39:22,470 get a lot better than you. 811 00:39:22,470 --> 00:39:23,720 PROFESSOR: Oh, I see. 812 00:39:26,590 --> 00:39:28,446 GUEST SPEAKER: You may want to talk about tokens and what it 813 00:39:28,446 --> 00:39:30,890 feels playing it ahead of you so that you can 814 00:39:30,890 --> 00:39:32,220 use them, you can-- 815 00:39:32,220 --> 00:39:34,372 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 816 00:39:34,372 --> 00:39:35,815 AUDIENCE: Rather then you just sit at the 817 00:39:35,815 --> 00:39:37,790 start point every time. 818 00:39:37,790 --> 00:39:40,254 AUDIENCE: So pretty much the person who goes second? 819 00:39:40,254 --> 00:39:43,160 AUDIENCE: Is at an advantage. 820 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,620 PROFESSOR: So that should be a negative feedback loop, which 821 00:39:46,620 --> 00:39:50,310 we'll we get to I guess in the next class, but the whole idea 822 00:39:50,310 --> 00:39:52,140 being there is a gap between players. 823 00:39:52,140 --> 00:39:55,250 And you have game mechanics specifically designed to 824 00:39:55,250 --> 00:39:56,380 narrow the gap. 825 00:39:56,380 --> 00:39:58,580 Those are negative feedback loops. 826 00:39:58,580 --> 00:39:59,810 AUDIENCE: Mario Kart! 827 00:39:59,810 --> 00:40:03,730 PROFESSOR: Mario Kart's blue shell, it's the other 828 00:40:03,730 --> 00:40:04,540 direction right? 829 00:40:04,540 --> 00:40:07,565 To knock back the person who's leading rather than helping 830 00:40:07,565 --> 00:40:09,710 you catch up. 831 00:40:09,710 --> 00:40:12,564 Actually, a lot of Mario Kart's mechanics are basically 832 00:40:12,564 --> 00:40:14,350 designed to help reduce the lead. 833 00:40:14,350 --> 00:40:15,600 All right, cool. 834 00:40:19,110 --> 00:40:21,680 AUDIENCE: They add one rule in keeping everything else equal. 835 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:26,030 They add a second die and then the way it worked was you 836 00:40:26,030 --> 00:40:29,280 arbitrarily assigned people odd or even numbers. 837 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:32,580 And then you roll and would go on that particular turn. 838 00:40:32,580 --> 00:40:34,216 And then that person, whoever it was 839 00:40:34,216 --> 00:40:36,030 assigned to, would play. 840 00:40:36,030 --> 00:40:37,660 And then you would roll again to see who would went the next 841 00:40:37,660 --> 00:40:40,660 turn and so on and so forth? 842 00:40:40,660 --> 00:40:42,026 PROFESSOR: How'd that feel? 843 00:40:45,232 --> 00:40:49,070 AUDIENCE: I got a tad memory with Mario Kart. 844 00:40:49,070 --> 00:40:50,320 PROFESSOR: It's like what, again? 845 00:40:52,330 --> 00:40:58,475 AUDIENCE: Many mechanics describe as very Mario Kart. 846 00:40:58,475 --> 00:41:00,840 PROFESSOR: Well, Mario Kart is actually a collection of a lot 847 00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:06,240 of fairly fundamental mechanics. 848 00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:11,080 AUDIENCE: I felt like just rolling to see who'd win. 849 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,860 The sense that you were just playing for luck. 850 00:41:13,860 --> 00:41:16,210 PROFESSOR: So it amplified the randomness basically? 851 00:41:16,210 --> 00:41:18,704 AUDIENCE: Yeah, which I actually detest personally. 852 00:41:21,692 --> 00:41:24,606 AUDIENCE: That rule is like initiative rule in Star Wars 853 00:41:24,606 --> 00:41:25,856 Miniatures and Dungeons and Dragons. 854 00:41:27,930 --> 00:41:31,210 And like in that case where there's actual strategic 855 00:41:31,210 --> 00:41:34,370 decisions to be made it's actually cool. 856 00:41:34,370 --> 00:41:36,820 Because it means that you never know whether you're 857 00:41:36,820 --> 00:41:38,780 going to be able to capitalize on the position that you're in 858 00:41:38,780 --> 00:41:40,750 at the end of the turn. 859 00:41:40,750 --> 00:41:43,530 AUDIENCE: But since we both know optimal strategy for the 860 00:41:43,530 --> 00:41:46,748 original game it was just pure luck. 861 00:41:46,748 --> 00:41:48,180 So there was no strategy. 862 00:41:48,180 --> 00:41:49,680 PROFESSOR: So it almost becomes like a gambling game 863 00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,554 or a game of chance. 864 00:41:52,554 --> 00:41:54,949 Cool. 865 00:41:54,949 --> 00:41:58,084 AUDIENCE: They added different dice you could roll for 866 00:41:58,084 --> 00:42:00,008 different effects. 867 00:42:00,008 --> 00:42:02,894 Such as, if you roll the D20 you can go 10 spaces. 868 00:42:02,894 --> 00:42:04,337 If you need to go 17, 18-- 869 00:42:04,337 --> 00:42:04,818 AUDIENCE: Or 18, 19, 20. 870 00:42:04,818 --> 00:42:04,978 AUDIENCE: -- 871 00:42:04,978 --> 00:42:06,742 Or 18, 19, 20. 872 00:42:06,742 --> 00:42:11,492 So they added the D10 which also had 873 00:42:11,492 --> 00:42:13,384 similar effects and deviate. 874 00:42:13,384 --> 00:42:16,060 So Patrick and I pretty much experimented with-- well, he 875 00:42:16,060 --> 00:42:17,310 just rolled D20 the entire time. 876 00:42:20,820 --> 00:42:29,855 And I experimented with rolling the D8 and the D10. 877 00:42:29,855 --> 00:42:33,030 AUDIENCE: Why would you not roll the D10? 878 00:42:33,030 --> 00:42:35,886 AUDIENCE: I started feeling impatient. 879 00:42:35,886 --> 00:42:37,315 I would forget everything about Alec and what 880 00:42:37,315 --> 00:42:38,290 he wanted to do. 881 00:42:38,290 --> 00:42:40,520 And every turn I would roll the D20 hoping to 882 00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:43,025 get 18, 19, or 20. 883 00:42:43,025 --> 00:42:44,477 AUDIENCE: By the way, with the D20 if you don't roll any of 884 00:42:44,477 --> 00:42:46,070 those you go zero spaces. 885 00:42:46,070 --> 00:42:48,216 So that's actually the risk. 886 00:42:48,216 --> 00:42:50,940 PROFESSOR: So you could either win the game or go nowhere. 887 00:42:54,390 --> 00:42:55,390 AUDIENCE: So I roll the D20 wanting to get 18,19, or 20. 888 00:42:55,390 --> 00:42:58,980 And not until I roll the 18, 19, or 20 would I care where 889 00:42:58,980 --> 00:43:01,592 he was on the board. 890 00:43:01,592 --> 00:43:03,772 PROFESSOR: It's you and the dice. 891 00:43:03,772 --> 00:43:05,694 It's just you and the randomness. 892 00:43:09,052 --> 00:43:10,302 AUDIENCE: I rolled twice too. 893 00:43:13,870 --> 00:43:16,090 PROFESSOR: Like what you described earlier is that 894 00:43:16,090 --> 00:43:19,220 whether you're behind or in front of someone changed the 895 00:43:19,220 --> 00:43:21,280 way that you would play in the original version. 896 00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:23,570 Now, no longer really matters anymore, right? 897 00:43:23,570 --> 00:43:26,110 It's just you and the dice. 898 00:43:26,110 --> 00:43:28,104 And when the universe loves you, you just 899 00:43:28,104 --> 00:43:28,680 automatically win. 900 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,910 AUDIENCE: The intention was to have the D20 for when you were 901 00:43:31,910 --> 00:43:33,530 way behind and the other one if you were 902 00:43:33,530 --> 00:43:34,950 only slightly behind. 903 00:43:34,950 --> 00:43:38,310 Apparently that's not how it was used. 904 00:43:38,310 --> 00:43:40,090 [INAUDIBLE] design, right? 905 00:43:40,090 --> 00:43:42,415 PROFESSOR: Well, a good example of the aesthetic you 906 00:43:42,415 --> 00:43:44,522 were going for not being the aesthetic that was actually 907 00:43:44,522 --> 00:43:45,740 experienced. 908 00:43:45,740 --> 00:43:48,821 So, it's still a powerful aesthetic it's just a 909 00:43:48,821 --> 00:43:51,767 different thing than what you planned. 910 00:43:51,767 --> 00:43:53,980 I think I might have skipped you guys? 911 00:43:53,980 --> 00:43:55,120 Sorry about that. 912 00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:59,670 AUDIENCE: So their new rule was, if you are physically 913 00:43:59,670 --> 00:44:02,990 ahead and you roll a six instead of only going three 914 00:44:02,990 --> 00:44:04,220 you would go four. 915 00:44:04,220 --> 00:44:06,340 PROFESSOR: If you're physically ahead and you roll 916 00:44:06,340 --> 00:44:07,790 a six you go? 917 00:44:07,790 --> 00:44:09,040 Oh, OK. 918 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:12,290 AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]. 919 00:44:15,195 --> 00:44:17,950 AUDIENCE: At first, we tried playing it in a similar way of 920 00:44:17,950 --> 00:44:18,750 how we did before. 921 00:44:18,750 --> 00:44:20,710 And it really felt like the person who was ahead 922 00:44:20,710 --> 00:44:21,890 was ahead even more. 923 00:44:21,890 --> 00:44:24,785 And now everyone's rolling, because as soon as you roll 924 00:44:24,785 --> 00:44:26,725 you get a higher expectation value. 925 00:44:30,490 --> 00:44:35,200 PROFESSOR: So you prefer the low-ball luck rather than the? 926 00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:39,740 AUDIENCE: So the problem is if you put a token down and they 927 00:44:39,740 --> 00:44:41,395 roll at least a one so you're guaranteed you're 928 00:44:41,395 --> 00:44:41,900 going to be the high. 929 00:44:41,900 --> 00:44:44,870 And then they have a higher expectation. 930 00:44:44,870 --> 00:44:47,778 PROFESSOR: How does it feel to play? 931 00:44:47,778 --> 00:44:51,400 Mathematically that's what it means, but-- 932 00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:52,090 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 933 00:44:52,090 --> 00:44:56,253 AUDIENCE: Actually, in playing the first game I don't think 934 00:44:56,253 --> 00:44:57,500 it actually came up at all. 935 00:44:57,500 --> 00:45:03,526 AUDIENCE: And then in the second game, I believe it did? 936 00:45:03,526 --> 00:45:06,610 And to me it didn't really feel like it changed. 937 00:45:06,610 --> 00:45:09,780 AUDIENCE: For me, the entire time I felt like the person 938 00:45:09,780 --> 00:45:13,460 who was ahead was more ahead. 939 00:45:13,460 --> 00:45:15,900 AUDIENCE: It would come up more if your board was longer. 940 00:45:15,900 --> 00:45:18,114 It really encourages you to stockpile for 941 00:45:18,114 --> 00:45:20,524 the first few turns. 942 00:45:20,524 --> 00:45:22,934 But if you're encouraged more than you might want to search. 943 00:45:22,934 --> 00:45:25,344 That's contrary to-- 944 00:45:25,344 --> 00:45:26,910 GUEST SPEAKER: When you guys were going over mistakes did 945 00:45:26,910 --> 00:45:29,220 you feel like it changed your strategy? 946 00:45:29,220 --> 00:45:30,470 AUDIENCE: Yes. 947 00:45:33,090 --> 00:45:36,590 AUDIENCE: It made rolling feel like a [INAUDIBLE]. 948 00:45:36,590 --> 00:45:38,060 Which was the point right? 949 00:45:38,060 --> 00:45:39,802 That's what you guys were aiming for? 950 00:45:39,802 --> 00:45:42,540 AUDIENCE: The alternate rule that we had toyed with was, if 951 00:45:42,540 --> 00:45:45,895 you're ahead and you put down a token you have to roll. 952 00:45:45,895 --> 00:45:48,250 And if you get a six you have to move one step back. 953 00:45:48,250 --> 00:45:51,741 So there's a one in six chance that there'll be a penalty for 954 00:45:51,741 --> 00:45:52,540 [INAUDIBLE]. 955 00:45:52,540 --> 00:45:54,453 Because precisely what you mentioned, which is that when 956 00:45:54,453 --> 00:45:55,436 you're ahead the dominant strategy is 957 00:45:55,436 --> 00:45:56,300 to reduce the variance. 958 00:45:56,300 --> 00:45:57,708 So we were just playing with stuff to make you want to roll 959 00:45:57,708 --> 00:45:59,190 more basically. 960 00:45:59,190 --> 00:46:08,380 PROFESSOR: OK, so dynamically that tells you to roll more. 961 00:46:08,380 --> 00:46:10,700 I would say aesthetically you have the whole Monopoly 962 00:46:10,700 --> 00:46:12,140 situation where the person who's 963 00:46:12,140 --> 00:46:13,730 winning just keeps winning. 964 00:46:13,730 --> 00:46:18,240 And there are times when you actually want that feeling. 965 00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:20,530 Especially when it came to the game of Monopoly, the whole 966 00:46:20,530 --> 00:46:24,003 point of the game was huge financial embarrassments. 967 00:46:24,003 --> 00:46:26,000 And it's like, wow I have no money and I'm just going to 968 00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:26,360 keep losing money. 969 00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:27,220 That was the point of the game actually. 970 00:46:27,220 --> 00:46:30,660 That's why it's called Monopoly. 971 00:46:30,660 --> 00:46:31,780 AUDIENCE: The thing about it is, the person who's 972 00:46:31,780 --> 00:46:34,620 physically ahead may not actually be ahead in terms of 973 00:46:34,620 --> 00:46:37,490 absolute game play because the other person 974 00:46:37,490 --> 00:46:39,960 has stockpiled tokens. 975 00:46:39,960 --> 00:46:42,909 And we weren't sure whether determining who was ahead by 976 00:46:42,909 --> 00:46:45,700 counting the tokens in the equation or not was a better 977 00:46:45,700 --> 00:46:48,700 game rule if we didn't have that type of test. 978 00:46:48,700 --> 00:46:51,430 PROFESSOR: Give it a shot [INAUDIBLE]. 979 00:46:51,430 --> 00:46:54,530 The one thing we came up with was-- 980 00:46:54,530 --> 00:46:56,140 at first we thought it wouldn't change the game at 981 00:46:56,140 --> 00:46:56,820 all I guess. 982 00:46:56,820 --> 00:46:59,650 Which was basically, instead of spending tokens to go 983 00:46:59,650 --> 00:47:02,786 forward two steps you spend tokens to knock your opponent 984 00:47:02,786 --> 00:47:04,974 back two steps. 985 00:47:04,974 --> 00:47:07,890 Completely changed the game play. 986 00:47:07,890 --> 00:47:08,862 AUDIENCE: We tried that. 987 00:47:08,862 --> 00:47:10,112 It sucks. 988 00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:15,280 AUDIENCE: Stock piled first and then you knock people back 989 00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,770 so you didn't go anywhere for the first 10 turns. 990 00:47:18,770 --> 00:47:20,198 And then you realize that nothing is going to happen. 991 00:47:20,198 --> 00:47:21,150 AUDIENCE: And then we just kept rolling. 992 00:47:21,150 --> 00:47:24,010 AUDIENCE: Rolled the rest of the time. 993 00:47:24,010 --> 00:47:24,860 PROFESSOR: Which is a completely different way to 994 00:47:24,860 --> 00:47:26,110 play the game. 995 00:47:27,830 --> 00:47:30,000 That whole process of stockpiling right at the 996 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:31,570 beginning is-- 997 00:47:31,570 --> 00:47:33,470 sure, we could have both started with a stack of three 998 00:47:33,470 --> 00:47:37,740 each because that's really what happened three turns in. 999 00:47:37,740 --> 00:47:39,940 But the whole act of-- 1000 00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:46,860 that felt really like, OK clearly you're 1001 00:47:46,860 --> 00:47:48,110 setting out to kill me. 1002 00:47:53,656 --> 00:47:54,800 AUDIENCE: Can you move? 1003 00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:57,500 PROFESSOR: No, we had it so it wouldn't be a point spending 1004 00:47:57,500 --> 00:48:00,030 it when you're right at the beginning. 1005 00:48:00,030 --> 00:48:02,960 But there was that whole arms race feel that really didn't 1006 00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:04,210 happen the first game. 1007 00:48:07,910 --> 00:48:13,820 All it did really was make the game longer, but it felt mean. 1008 00:48:13,820 --> 00:48:20,060 OK, that's pretty much it for today I guess. 1009 00:48:20,060 --> 00:48:22,530 GUEST SPEAKER: And we need the poker chips and all the dice 1010 00:48:22,530 --> 00:48:23,054 back but you can keep the game boards if you're 1011 00:48:23,054 --> 00:48:24,304 really happy with them. 1012 00:48:31,994 --> 00:48:34,160 AUDIENCE: How long did this game take you to make? 1013 00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:35,630 GUEST SPEAKER: It took longer to make the board 1014 00:48:35,630 --> 00:48:36,880 than to make the rules.