1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,470 The following content is provided under a Creative 2 00:00:02,470 --> 00:00:03,880 Commons license. 3 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:06,920 Your support will help MIT OpenCourseWare continue to 4 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:10,570 offer high quality educational resources for free. 5 00:00:10,570 --> 00:00:13,470 To make a donation, or view additional materials from 6 00:00:13,470 --> 00:00:17,875 hundreds of MIT courses, visit MIT OpenCourseWare at 7 00:00:17,875 --> 00:00:20,040 OCW.MIT.edu. 8 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:22,220 PROFESSOR: Today is pretty much just set aside for 9 00:00:22,220 --> 00:00:23,080 brainstorming. 10 00:00:23,080 --> 00:00:26,202 So we're probably going to do about an hour of that. 11 00:00:26,202 --> 00:00:28,396 Just to throw the ideas that people already have in their 12 00:00:28,396 --> 00:00:32,246 heads about what could be with the problem space that we're 13 00:00:32,246 --> 00:00:34,442 working on. 14 00:00:34,442 --> 00:00:41,381 This whole preparing people to deal with violence and folks 15 00:00:41,381 --> 00:00:42,840 suffering from an illness. 16 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:45,922 And there's a whole bunch of different things that people 17 00:00:45,922 --> 00:00:47,070 may be working on. 18 00:00:47,070 --> 00:00:50,150 And the idea is that hopefully we can get this all out and 19 00:00:50,150 --> 00:00:53,020 then we can spend the next half-hour, and frankly the 20 00:00:53,020 --> 00:00:54,920 rest of this week, trying to figure out 21 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,000 who's in which team. 22 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,002 Who's collaborating on a similar topic and who's 23 00:01:00,002 --> 00:01:03,580 interested in what. 24 00:01:03,580 --> 00:01:07,040 And then, anyone actually get through any of the readings? 25 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:07,760 OK, great. 26 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:10,160 So there's a few things up there. 27 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:11,926 I realize that we don't have a lot of time to read. 28 00:01:11,926 --> 00:01:14,550 And there's probably more stuff up there to read that 29 00:01:14,550 --> 00:01:16,550 needs to be read necessarily. 30 00:01:16,550 --> 00:01:18,770 But it's all there as resources. 31 00:01:18,770 --> 00:01:21,555 Any ideas that people thought might be 32 00:01:21,555 --> 00:01:22,805 interesting to work on? 33 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:26,220 Andrew? 34 00:01:26,220 --> 00:01:28,560 AUDIENCE: So one of the basic issues I heard from the 35 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,220 presentation, and the papers, was communication. 36 00:01:31,220 --> 00:01:35,330 So this may work as a simulation, but the real world 37 00:01:35,330 --> 00:01:43,055 system would be communication between the psychiatrist and 38 00:01:43,055 --> 00:01:44,050 the patient. 39 00:01:44,050 --> 00:01:47,990 Along with the psychiatrist with the person above them. 40 00:01:47,990 --> 00:01:49,830 PROFESSOR: Psychiatrist, patient, communication? 41 00:01:49,830 --> 00:01:51,080 AUDIENCE: Yes. 42 00:01:53,435 --> 00:01:55,890 What do they call them? 43 00:01:55,890 --> 00:01:57,250 Not the patient. 44 00:01:57,250 --> 00:01:59,130 Patient, psychiatrist? 45 00:01:59,130 --> 00:02:00,840 AUDIENCE: Orderly? 46 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:01,285 AUDIENCE: Nurse? 47 00:02:01,285 --> 00:02:03,070 AUDIENCE: What function do they have? 48 00:02:03,070 --> 00:02:04,320 AUDIENCE: Give us more information. 49 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:09,820 AUDIENCE: Psychiatrist-Patient for now that's fine. 50 00:02:09,820 --> 00:02:11,650 PROFESSOR: You know how talking about psychiatrists 51 00:02:11,650 --> 00:02:14,055 there is patient. 52 00:02:14,055 --> 00:02:16,180 Psychiatrist, resident? 53 00:02:16,180 --> 00:02:17,920 AUDIENCE: Maybe like nurse, patient, and then nurse 54 00:02:17,920 --> 00:02:21,420 reporting incidents to supervisors? 55 00:02:21,420 --> 00:02:22,920 PROFESSOR:Three levels? 56 00:02:22,920 --> 00:02:25,002 AUDIENCE: Yes, that's the one. 57 00:02:25,002 --> 00:02:27,210 PROFESSOR: So it would go supervisor, nurse-- 58 00:02:27,210 --> 00:02:28,850 AUDIENCE: I'm sorry, guys. 59 00:02:28,850 --> 00:02:29,806 PROFESSOR: --and you have the patient. 60 00:02:29,806 --> 00:02:32,196 Those kinds of reporting up and reporting down. 61 00:02:32,196 --> 00:02:35,015 All right, yeah? 62 00:02:35,015 --> 00:02:36,420 AUDIENCE: So I had a couple ideas. 63 00:02:36,420 --> 00:02:41,040 One of them was, every idea you have a patient and there's 64 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:44,900 two doctors or psychiatrists. 65 00:02:44,900 --> 00:02:49,350 And so one psychiatrist is trying to calm the patient 66 00:02:49,350 --> 00:02:51,530 while the other is doing the opposite and trying to make 67 00:02:51,530 --> 00:02:53,620 this patient as angry as possible. 68 00:02:53,620 --> 00:02:58,280 So the way I was thinking was, the psychiatrist that's trying 69 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:00,290 to enrage the patient? 70 00:03:00,290 --> 00:03:03,010 That's training in what not to say. 71 00:03:03,010 --> 00:03:07,720 While the doctor who is trying to calm them down is-- 72 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:12,820 PROFESSOR: So by showing what's the worst possible way? 73 00:03:12,820 --> 00:03:15,476 OK, I'm going to call that good cop, bad cop. 74 00:03:15,476 --> 00:03:18,030 AUDIENCE: --Yeah, and then another idea I had which I 75 00:03:18,030 --> 00:03:21,990 thought of with [UNINTELLIGIBLE] yesterday was 76 00:03:21,990 --> 00:03:26,390 have a team of psychiatrists working with one patient. 77 00:03:26,390 --> 00:03:31,860 But interlaced in one of the psychiatrists is a saboteur 78 00:03:31,860 --> 00:03:36,820 trying to enrage the patient as well. 79 00:03:36,820 --> 00:03:39,594 PROFESSOR: And what are the target audiences going to be 80 00:03:39,594 --> 00:03:40,844 like actual residents. 81 00:03:43,290 --> 00:03:48,080 I'm just going to say a saboteur in a group of 82 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:49,330 psychiatrists. 83 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:55,277 Because maybe there's an idea under that dynamic 84 00:03:55,277 --> 00:03:56,470 that we can play with. 85 00:03:56,470 --> 00:03:57,620 OK? 86 00:03:57,620 --> 00:03:59,340 AUDIENCE: OK, so a few quick things. 87 00:03:59,340 --> 00:04:02,290 One would be, I'm not exactly sure how 88 00:04:02,290 --> 00:04:03,980 this fits into a game. 89 00:04:03,980 --> 00:04:07,690 But simulating people who are delusional schizophrenic by 90 00:04:07,690 --> 00:04:12,700 either having every player have a separate audio track 91 00:04:12,700 --> 00:04:14,250 playing in their ear as they play? 92 00:04:14,250 --> 00:04:16,339 So there's voices speaking to them and they have different 93 00:04:16,339 --> 00:04:17,140 audio experiences. 94 00:04:17,140 --> 00:04:21,350 Or having just one speaker that everyone can hear that's 95 00:04:21,350 --> 00:04:22,175 playing audio. 96 00:04:22,175 --> 00:04:24,250 So incorporating audio into the experience to simulate in 97 00:04:24,250 --> 00:04:26,640 some way the internal thought processes and perhaps these 98 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:27,560 delusional thoughts. 99 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,308 The voice that tells you to go kill your mother and what not. 100 00:04:30,308 --> 00:04:32,220 Which is a documented issue. 101 00:04:32,220 --> 00:04:33,663 PROFESSOR: This particular game doesn't have to be a 102 00:04:33,663 --> 00:04:35,330 board game, doesn't have to be a card game, you have a lot 103 00:04:35,330 --> 00:04:37,830 more flexibility in what you want to do. 104 00:04:37,830 --> 00:04:40,137 I would suggest steering away from doing anything that 105 00:04:40,137 --> 00:04:41,270 requires digital logic. 106 00:04:41,270 --> 00:04:44,966 But MP3 players would be perfect. 107 00:04:44,966 --> 00:04:46,820 AUDIENCE: Exactly, something like that. 108 00:04:46,820 --> 00:04:49,205 So the second thing would be a board game where you're in 109 00:04:49,205 --> 00:04:50,170 charge of managing a ward. 110 00:04:50,170 --> 00:04:51,280 It's just a logistical game. 111 00:04:51,280 --> 00:04:54,690 Making sure that you don't leave anyone neglected or 112 00:04:54,690 --> 00:04:57,445 forget anyone. 113 00:04:57,445 --> 00:05:01,860 So your patients have their favorite nurse, and they have 114 00:05:01,860 --> 00:05:04,500 issues that you have to uncover and deal with. 115 00:05:04,500 --> 00:05:06,670 And if you leave somebody unattended and someone goes 116 00:05:06,670 --> 00:05:07,510 over they may become violent. 117 00:05:07,510 --> 00:05:09,700 So you've got to try and make sure. 118 00:05:09,700 --> 00:05:13,483 And then the third idea would be to have one player play as 119 00:05:13,483 --> 00:05:16,620 the patient and to simulate their inability to communicate 120 00:05:16,620 --> 00:05:18,420 properly for whatever reason. 121 00:05:18,420 --> 00:05:20,803 The information of their condition is 122 00:05:20,803 --> 00:05:21,970 hidden from the player. 123 00:05:21,970 --> 00:05:25,510 And so try to create a game experience that is genuinely 124 00:05:25,510 --> 00:05:29,940 frustrating because the player doesn't quite know what's 125 00:05:29,940 --> 00:05:31,530 wrong with them and can't articulate it properly. 126 00:05:31,530 --> 00:05:33,880 And the other players are in charge of finding it out. 127 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:35,990 And putting some kind of time-constraint things where 128 00:05:35,990 --> 00:05:37,020 it gets heated. 129 00:05:37,020 --> 00:05:38,653 PROFESSOR: There are a bunch of improv games that are 130 00:05:38,653 --> 00:05:39,380 exactly that. 131 00:05:39,380 --> 00:05:42,230 I have something about me but can't tell you what it is. 132 00:05:42,230 --> 00:05:46,150 AUDIENCE: But the players know that it can get really, yeah. 133 00:05:46,150 --> 00:05:47,872 AUDIENCE: That's like the game where you have, I can't 134 00:05:47,872 --> 00:05:50,530 remember what it's called, but the one where you have to try 135 00:05:50,530 --> 00:05:52,350 to make the other person say a word. 136 00:05:52,350 --> 00:05:54,866 But you can't use a certain series of key words. 137 00:05:59,290 --> 00:06:02,700 AUDIENCE: I'm simulating schizophrenia with audio tape. 138 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,850 Being part of RPG's which have done that well. 139 00:06:08,850 --> 00:06:11,270 So like live-action role playing stuff. 140 00:06:11,270 --> 00:06:12,530 Which did it really well. 141 00:06:12,530 --> 00:06:13,510 It actually works. 142 00:06:13,510 --> 00:06:17,350 So I recommend that. 143 00:06:17,350 --> 00:06:20,561 It's been tried in a setting which I've seen before and 144 00:06:20,561 --> 00:06:21,050 worked really well. 145 00:06:21,050 --> 00:06:23,770 So I think it could work out. 146 00:06:23,770 --> 00:06:28,000 PROFESSOR: You could do a refinement on that idea. 147 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,770 AUDIENCE: So I know one of the main things that he was 148 00:06:30,770 --> 00:06:34,080 talking about was knowing what to do and just going through 149 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:36,530 the process of what happens when somebody does something. 150 00:06:36,530 --> 00:06:39,990 And so that brought to mind D & D, and how you have to 151 00:06:39,990 --> 00:06:42,840 prepare for the encounter and then in the encounter you have 152 00:06:42,840 --> 00:06:44,960 certain actions that you can do. 153 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:48,290 Calm through speech, calm through presenting some 154 00:06:48,290 --> 00:06:50,780 object, or some idea or whatever. 155 00:06:50,780 --> 00:06:55,210 Which I think would map pretty easily into the D & D space. 156 00:06:55,210 --> 00:06:58,550 And then you could also have certain abilities which are 157 00:06:58,550 --> 00:07:01,240 natural to your character like you're very charismatic which 158 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,790 makes some things easier and such. 159 00:07:04,790 --> 00:07:11,542 So simplify D & D to handle interactions with patients. 160 00:07:11,542 --> 00:07:14,080 PROFESSOR: So table-top RPG style. 161 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,120 And the kind of things you want to emphasize are things 162 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:20,950 like preparation and playing up your actual skills? 163 00:07:20,950 --> 00:07:21,742 AUDIENCE: Right. 164 00:07:21,742 --> 00:07:23,218 PROFESSOR: Things that you're good at. 165 00:07:27,646 --> 00:07:28,896 So natural skills and preparation. 166 00:07:34,050 --> 00:07:36,610 AUDIENCE: So I had an idea for a game that could potentially 167 00:07:36,610 --> 00:07:37,550 be a card game. 168 00:07:37,550 --> 00:07:40,520 Where the player who's playing as the patient and the player 169 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:42,310 who's playing as the doctor are operating 170 00:07:42,310 --> 00:07:43,750 under different rules. 171 00:07:43,750 --> 00:07:46,240 And one of the main points of the game is they're not 172 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:48,150 actually aware of the other player's rules. 173 00:07:48,150 --> 00:07:50,450 So, for instance the patient could have certain goals which 174 00:07:50,450 --> 00:07:52,000 he is trying to achieve. 175 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:55,020 But he is unaware which of these goals is completely 176 00:07:55,020 --> 00:07:56,780 unreasonable to the doctor. 177 00:07:56,780 --> 00:08:01,220 And the doctor has certain actions he can take and is 178 00:08:01,220 --> 00:08:02,530 unaware which of these are going to be 179 00:08:02,530 --> 00:08:04,150 threatening to the patient. 180 00:08:04,150 --> 00:08:06,970 And so, then there could be an instance where the patient 181 00:08:06,970 --> 00:08:09,330 actually believes the only way he is capable of winning the 182 00:08:09,330 --> 00:08:11,000 game is by using violence. 183 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:14,184 And so that could be one of the end conditions. 184 00:08:14,184 --> 00:08:15,627 PROFESSOR: So, sure. 185 00:08:15,627 --> 00:08:19,480 And you have to deduce that out? 186 00:08:19,480 --> 00:08:21,020 Moving on to Michelle? 187 00:08:21,020 --> 00:08:23,890 AUDIENCE: I like the idea that a psychiatrist has to really 188 00:08:23,890 --> 00:08:26,170 keep their composure when dealing with a violent person. 189 00:08:26,170 --> 00:08:27,050 They can't raise their voice. 190 00:08:27,050 --> 00:08:29,200 They have to keep at a certain distance. 191 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,740 And they can't seem upset for whatever reason. 192 00:08:32,740 --> 00:08:37,230 Sort of a party game idea, you could have two people. 193 00:08:37,230 --> 00:08:39,570 Basically, one person would just have to be throwing 194 00:08:39,570 --> 00:08:40,576 insults at the other person. 195 00:08:40,576 --> 00:08:42,659 And the person who's receiving the insults would just have to 196 00:08:42,659 --> 00:08:45,800 stay calm the whole time and continue to talking. 197 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:47,370 Which is really hard to do even if you know it's coming. 198 00:08:47,370 --> 00:08:49,320 PROFESSOR: So keep your cool. 199 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:52,050 I mean, that could be a game where you're literally 200 00:08:52,050 --> 00:08:54,210 insulting someone or it could be a thing where you're 201 00:08:54,210 --> 00:08:56,630 playing a character with a certain amount of composure 202 00:08:56,630 --> 00:09:01,045 points or something and you're planning actions and 203 00:09:01,045 --> 00:09:03,812 maintaining notes. 204 00:09:03,812 --> 00:09:06,800 And different tactics to be able to increase those or 205 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,650 decrease those. 206 00:09:09,650 --> 00:09:12,610 AUDIENCE: A co-op type of game where you are a bunch of 207 00:09:12,610 --> 00:09:14,830 nurses trying to take care of the ward. 208 00:09:14,830 --> 00:09:17,950 This is a lot like Jeremy's Diner Dash style game. 209 00:09:17,950 --> 00:09:20,370 Except, you have a limitation to how you can 210 00:09:20,370 --> 00:09:21,190 actually do it once. 211 00:09:21,190 --> 00:09:23,865 So you will be forced to neglect one often. 212 00:09:23,865 --> 00:09:24,150 PROFESSOR: A patient, one? 213 00:09:24,150 --> 00:09:25,400 Neglect one patient? 214 00:09:28,430 --> 00:09:29,900 AUDIENCE: So nurses will get sick and 215 00:09:29,900 --> 00:09:31,150 they'll have to leave. 216 00:09:33,470 --> 00:09:37,455 PROFESSOR: So, rather you have limited resources. 217 00:09:37,455 --> 00:09:40,365 Not quite nearly enough to deal with every single crisis 218 00:09:40,365 --> 00:09:42,800 that's going to happen. 219 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,570 AUDIENCE: So the one thing I found interesting in reading 220 00:09:45,570 --> 00:09:49,580 this stuff is statistically the amount of violence that 221 00:09:49,580 --> 00:09:54,996 happens with mental patients is not actually that different 222 00:09:54,996 --> 00:09:56,324 from the amount of violence that happens in the general 223 00:09:56,324 --> 00:09:57,190 population. 224 00:09:57,190 --> 00:10:00,220 And it talks about how people going through this, and 225 00:10:00,220 --> 00:10:02,210 deciding to go into the profession, might actually 226 00:10:02,210 --> 00:10:03,640 second guess themselves because they have this 227 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:05,095 perception of there's more violence. 228 00:10:05,095 --> 00:10:08,365 So I think incorporating something where you have life 229 00:10:08,365 --> 00:10:13,050 in the ward and life outside of it. 230 00:10:13,050 --> 00:10:15,670 So you incorporate both the things where you're trying to 231 00:10:15,670 --> 00:10:18,700 deal with patients but you're also reinforcing this idea 232 00:10:18,700 --> 00:10:23,200 that it's not significantly more dangerous 233 00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:24,680 than real life is. 234 00:10:24,680 --> 00:10:26,160 AUDIENCE: None of your patients stab you but you get 235 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:26,610 mugged on the way home. 236 00:10:26,610 --> 00:10:29,280 AUDIENCE: Yeah, something like that. 237 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:31,140 It's just life. 238 00:10:34,100 --> 00:10:39,950 PROFESSOR: One thing that could be really attractive is 239 00:10:39,950 --> 00:10:43,060 that now broadens your audience to people who aren't 240 00:10:43,060 --> 00:10:45,670 just psychiatric residents. 241 00:10:49,230 --> 00:10:52,230 AUDIENCE: So, I like the idea of the patient and doctor 242 00:10:52,230 --> 00:10:55,590 having different roles, rules, goals, views, et cetera. 243 00:10:55,590 --> 00:10:59,740 But I also like the idea of incorporating an escalation 244 00:10:59,740 --> 00:11:02,330 and de-escalation into the conflict 245 00:11:02,330 --> 00:11:03,850 between the two of them. 246 00:11:03,850 --> 00:11:07,160 So I feel like part of the thing which was really 247 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:08,280 compelling about the role-playing scenario which 248 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:12,250 they showed was there was then sense in which the doctor can 249 00:11:12,250 --> 00:11:17,054 say things which can escalate or de-escalate the situation. 250 00:11:17,054 --> 00:11:20,750 Make it more or less likely that things will go a bad way. 251 00:11:20,750 --> 00:11:24,577 And one way which that could be done partially through 252 00:11:24,577 --> 00:11:29,620 roles would be to have hidden keywords which the patient 253 00:11:29,620 --> 00:11:32,468 responds to or what have you and that moves them into a 254 00:11:32,468 --> 00:11:32,800 different state. 255 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:36,726 And then transitioning between these two states changes the 256 00:11:36,726 --> 00:11:41,780 goals which the patient has so maybe the intent on trying to 257 00:11:41,780 --> 00:11:43,480 get Nurse-- what was the nurse's name? 258 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:43,810 Dave? 259 00:11:43,810 --> 00:11:44,210 AUDIENCE: John. 260 00:11:44,210 --> 00:11:46,000 AUDIENCE: Nurse John. 261 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,800 But as they get de-escalated then they just want to change 262 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:49,210 their meds. 263 00:11:49,210 --> 00:11:54,410 But then as they get de-escalated from that then 264 00:11:54,410 --> 00:11:56,010 they just want to go run back out. 265 00:11:56,010 --> 00:12:00,139 PROFESSOR: Just coming up with the rules that model what an 266 00:12:00,139 --> 00:12:05,290 unreasonable patient would do or what are you 267 00:12:05,290 --> 00:12:06,500 willing to give up. 268 00:12:06,500 --> 00:12:10,144 And actually putting somebody in the shoes of that, is 269 00:12:10,144 --> 00:12:11,675 essentially something to think about what 270 00:12:11,675 --> 00:12:14,710 I can do as a doctor. 271 00:12:14,710 --> 00:12:16,542 AUDIENCE: So, there was this guy we used to play in my 272 00:12:16,542 --> 00:12:19,700 family where you're given a scenario and certain number of 273 00:12:19,700 --> 00:12:23,830 words you can't use. 274 00:12:23,830 --> 00:12:28,140 Essentially, you choose random words and you have a scenario. 275 00:12:28,140 --> 00:12:30,350 Basically what you were saying where certain keywords do 276 00:12:30,350 --> 00:12:30,950 certain things. 277 00:12:30,950 --> 00:12:35,840 But you have to somehow create the best story or the best 278 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:39,520 calm-down passage to read to the patient. 279 00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:44,220 And then there's some arbitrator, the GM of the 280 00:12:44,220 --> 00:12:47,640 game, that decides which of the three people that were 281 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:52,400 playing which one had the best story out of those. 282 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,280 To get you to have to come up with something to deal with, 283 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:57,532 You need Nurse John right away. 284 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:03,480 PROFESSOR: You could do a thing where you had to create 285 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:06,995 a story about a random explanation 286 00:13:06,995 --> 00:13:08,960 of elements or cards. 287 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:14,984 But then some number of those cards, specifically the other 288 00:13:14,984 --> 00:13:16,418 player or maybe the game of other players specifically 289 00:13:16,418 --> 00:13:17,852 just saying. 290 00:13:17,852 --> 00:13:20,720 Those internally are supposed to be our keywords. 291 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:24,452 And there's some 20 questions type of way to try and figure 292 00:13:24,452 --> 00:13:27,350 out what those cards are. 293 00:13:27,350 --> 00:13:31,710 So that would be like a doctor trying to figure out what 294 00:13:31,710 --> 00:13:34,454 they're dealing with while they're [INAUDIBLE]. 295 00:13:37,298 --> 00:13:39,668 AUDIENCE: You can make that game like Guess Who. 296 00:13:39,668 --> 00:13:43,420 Where each person draws a card and you have to give a 297 00:13:43,420 --> 00:13:47,108 statement to the other person or ask them something. 298 00:13:47,108 --> 00:13:49,814 And then you see whether they escalate or de-escalate and 299 00:13:49,814 --> 00:13:52,520 each individual card has a trade story. 300 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:53,012 If you talk about this that's bad. 301 00:13:53,012 --> 00:13:53,504 If you talk about this that's good. 302 00:13:53,504 --> 00:13:56,456 PROFESSOR: I'm not familiar with Guess Who. 303 00:13:56,456 --> 00:13:58,178 AUDIENCE: OK, so it's not really that 304 00:13:58,178 --> 00:14:01,870 much like Guess Who. 305 00:14:01,870 --> 00:14:04,470 AUDIENCE: 20 questions? 306 00:14:04,470 --> 00:14:06,650 AUDIENCE: What I can think of is everyone just has a whole 307 00:14:06,650 --> 00:14:09,670 bunch of character cards and each of them have traits. 308 00:14:09,670 --> 00:14:10,695 Like, watch this. 309 00:14:10,695 --> 00:14:14,074 If you you say this they'll get upset. 310 00:14:14,074 --> 00:14:16,504 If you say this, it's not very fully fleshed out. 311 00:14:16,504 --> 00:14:17,962 But everyone just randomly draws traits. 312 00:14:17,962 --> 00:14:20,392 And you just take turns speaking to each other. 313 00:14:20,392 --> 00:14:21,910 And then the patients either will 314 00:14:21,910 --> 00:14:23,980 respond or get more angry. 315 00:14:23,980 --> 00:14:29,130 PROFESSOR: So it's almost like your role is a collection of 316 00:14:29,130 --> 00:14:36,265 randomized traits or randomized behavioral rules. 317 00:14:39,488 --> 00:14:45,832 So, rules determined by randomized rules. 318 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:50,548 For those people in the Assassin's Guild, or are 319 00:14:50,548 --> 00:14:55,592 familiar with the Assassin's Guild, there's the concept of 320 00:14:55,592 --> 00:14:56,630 assignments. 321 00:14:56,630 --> 00:15:05,055 Things that you as an individual player are given at 322 00:15:05,055 --> 00:15:06,892 the beginning of the game as things that you can do and 323 00:15:06,892 --> 00:15:07,750 have to do. 324 00:15:07,750 --> 00:15:09,220 Or if you do something you have to do it in these 325 00:15:09,220 --> 00:15:10,210 specific conditions. 326 00:15:10,210 --> 00:15:13,150 Psychological limitations is what they're called. 327 00:15:13,150 --> 00:15:14,488 It could be something as simple as you have to speak in 328 00:15:14,488 --> 00:15:17,771 an accent all the time or you have to limp. 329 00:15:17,771 --> 00:15:19,390 It could be something more like every time you see blood 330 00:15:19,390 --> 00:15:24,655 you have to run away because there's a [INAUDIBLE]. 331 00:15:24,655 --> 00:15:26,317 It might be interesting to think of a collection of those 332 00:15:26,317 --> 00:15:30,370 things and that crafts how we play. 333 00:15:30,370 --> 00:15:32,340 So this makes me think I should probably do the 334 00:15:32,340 --> 00:15:36,264 live-action class at some point and talk about party 335 00:15:36,264 --> 00:15:39,722 games and role-playing games. 336 00:15:39,722 --> 00:15:40,710 I think you had your hands up? 337 00:15:40,710 --> 00:15:42,668 AUDIENCE: No, my hands are in my pocket. 338 00:15:42,668 --> 00:15:45,850 PROFESSOR: Your hands are just up, correct? 339 00:15:45,850 --> 00:15:48,697 AUDIENCE: Another thing that psychiatrists do when they're 340 00:15:48,697 --> 00:15:50,370 talking to a patient is to try and get the story out of them 341 00:15:50,370 --> 00:15:52,650 as to why they're upset. 342 00:15:52,650 --> 00:15:57,840 So you could have a game where the patient has some set of 343 00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:03,965 cards that has some set of story with some keywords and 344 00:16:03,965 --> 00:16:07,145 the doctor has to try and get these words out of him. 345 00:16:07,145 --> 00:16:11,520 But the patient, himself, doesn't fully know his story 346 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:12,720 so it keeps on changing. 347 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:14,910 You can keep modifying your story as you go by drawing 348 00:16:14,910 --> 00:16:16,620 cards and putting them away. 349 00:16:16,620 --> 00:16:18,720 And you can only really get the full picture once you get 350 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:20,950 all the cards from the patient that you can. 351 00:16:20,950 --> 00:16:24,500 PROFESSOR: So, does the patient have all the cards? 352 00:16:24,500 --> 00:16:26,930 AUDIENCE: The patient has his full story 353 00:16:26,930 --> 00:16:28,180 but it keeps changing. 354 00:16:30,820 --> 00:16:38,110 PROFESSOR: So, ever-changing story and you want to stay on 355 00:16:38,110 --> 00:16:39,516 top of [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 356 00:16:39,516 --> 00:16:41,981 AUDIENCE: Yes. 357 00:16:41,981 --> 00:16:43,953 AUDIENCE: This isn't really a fleshed out idea. 358 00:16:43,953 --> 00:16:46,270 But as a mechanic? 359 00:16:46,270 --> 00:16:49,270 Say there's a doctor and a patient and the only 360 00:16:49,270 --> 00:16:50,810 communication is through cards. 361 00:16:50,810 --> 00:16:54,245 So the doctor will give the patient two cards, and then 362 00:16:54,245 --> 00:16:57,906 the third card is randomly inserted off of a deck and 363 00:16:57,906 --> 00:16:58,490 shuffled in. 364 00:16:58,490 --> 00:17:00,090 The patient receives all three. 365 00:17:00,090 --> 00:17:02,790 So the patient might be schizophrenic 366 00:17:02,790 --> 00:17:03,340 and imagining things. 367 00:17:03,340 --> 00:17:06,255 And they get what the doctor is saying but they also get 368 00:17:06,255 --> 00:17:08,700 other random things as points. 369 00:17:08,700 --> 00:17:14,071 PROFESSOR: So as a mechanic that would be-- 370 00:17:14,071 --> 00:17:15,321 man, that's hard to describe. 371 00:17:17,589 --> 00:17:19,890 The idea that you will be adding the randomized element. 372 00:17:19,890 --> 00:17:22,290 AUDIENCE: So you get information that is both what 373 00:17:22,290 --> 00:17:24,460 the other person played, and something random, and you 374 00:17:24,460 --> 00:17:25,710 can't distinguish which is which. 375 00:17:28,050 --> 00:17:29,296 AUDIENCE: You have a communication channel and 376 00:17:29,296 --> 00:17:30,490 you're adding random noise. 377 00:17:30,490 --> 00:17:32,940 PROFESSOR: Yeah. 378 00:17:32,940 --> 00:17:34,410 Is that a question [INAUDIBLE]? 379 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:44,396 I am running out of space, so that's a good thing. 380 00:17:48,229 --> 00:17:51,708 Any other ideas? 381 00:17:51,708 --> 00:17:52,958 That's creepy. 382 00:18:01,648 --> 00:18:02,898 Anyone else? 383 00:18:06,618 --> 00:18:07,612 AUDIENCE: One concept I thought was interesting, 384 00:18:07,612 --> 00:18:09,290 though I'm not really sure how to turn it into a game 385 00:18:09,290 --> 00:18:15,490 immediately, is the idea of the patient and specifically 386 00:18:15,490 --> 00:18:18,870 the doctor or the rest of the world having at the moment 387 00:18:18,870 --> 00:18:21,970 irreconcilable narratives. 388 00:18:21,970 --> 00:18:26,670 And the goal of bringing those into some type of medium in 389 00:18:26,670 --> 00:18:31,326 which the patient can comfortably exist with this 390 00:18:31,326 --> 00:18:35,720 narrative that's in line with the rest of the world. 391 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:41,950 PROFESSOR: So the idea, again, of narrative disruption is why 392 00:18:41,950 --> 00:18:44,430 people get violent in the first place. 393 00:18:44,430 --> 00:18:48,560 So maybe even taking out the question entirely of is this 394 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:52,010 person going to act violently, but can you even work together 395 00:18:52,010 --> 00:18:55,886 with somebody to change how they see the world until it 396 00:18:55,886 --> 00:18:59,750 makes sense on both sides. 397 00:18:59,750 --> 00:19:02,548 AUDIENCE: So with that, something I can't actually 398 00:19:02,548 --> 00:19:07,716 think of a game for it right now, be something like you 399 00:19:07,716 --> 00:19:13,766 have the patient and doctor. 400 00:19:13,766 --> 00:19:16,742 One person trying to figure out the other person, the 401 00:19:16,742 --> 00:19:17,900 other person trying to trigger the other. 402 00:19:17,900 --> 00:19:20,730 But there's something in the middle that's changing 403 00:19:20,730 --> 00:19:22,050 everything. 404 00:19:22,050 --> 00:19:26,292 So it's just trying to reconcile the difference. 405 00:19:26,292 --> 00:19:26,964 Figuring out the connection and 406 00:19:26,964 --> 00:19:28,540 communication between the two. 407 00:19:28,540 --> 00:19:31,010 PROFESSOR: So you have a situation where you actually 408 00:19:31,010 --> 00:19:32,490 have three people playing. 409 00:19:32,490 --> 00:19:38,671 And there's one person who's changing information on some 410 00:19:38,671 --> 00:19:40,270 predictable or unpredictable way. 411 00:19:40,270 --> 00:19:42,850 AUDIENCE: Maybe they have their own objective in mind. 412 00:19:45,590 --> 00:19:48,620 The two people on the ends are trying to figure out what the 413 00:19:48,620 --> 00:19:51,712 other one's saying and then one person in the middle has 414 00:19:51,712 --> 00:19:56,710 their own agenda, representing schizophrenia. 415 00:19:56,710 --> 00:20:01,260 PROFESSOR: So there's a noisy communication channel with an 416 00:20:01,260 --> 00:20:02,510 agenda --I like that. 417 00:20:06,590 --> 00:20:11,206 That could be an algorithm or that could be a person. 418 00:20:11,206 --> 00:20:13,520 It could be a person running an algorithm in their head. 419 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:17,856 AUDIENCE: I mean the noisy communication channel, or the 420 00:20:17,856 --> 00:20:19,606 actual state of mind of the patient, that 421 00:20:19,606 --> 00:20:22,036 is the point right? 422 00:20:22,036 --> 00:20:25,540 And then depending on their level of arousal, that could 423 00:20:25,540 --> 00:20:28,750 change how everything gets screened 424 00:20:28,750 --> 00:20:32,660 into being very combative. 425 00:20:32,660 --> 00:20:37,682 And so everything the doctor says is taken as being. 426 00:20:41,070 --> 00:20:43,593 PROFESSOR: Some sort of parable that's actually going 427 00:20:43,593 --> 00:20:47,200 to affect how they were able to [INAUDIBLE]. 428 00:20:50,116 --> 00:20:52,730 OK. 429 00:20:52,730 --> 00:20:54,352 AUDIENCE: This would probably only work once, the first time 430 00:20:54,352 --> 00:20:57,800 you play through, but again you've concealed from the 431 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:02,510 players, or certain players, themselves 432 00:21:02,510 --> 00:21:04,660 what their goals are. 433 00:21:04,660 --> 00:21:06,760 Or what they believe think about the game. 434 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:10,080 Say, it is in fact a delusion or not true. 435 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:16,050 So you might tell them that it's about a game set in 2100 436 00:21:16,050 --> 00:21:18,180 when you've been wrongly imprisoned in a psychiatric 437 00:21:18,180 --> 00:21:20,210 ward and you must fight your way out or 438 00:21:20,210 --> 00:21:21,270 something like that. 439 00:21:21,270 --> 00:21:24,440 And there's a voice that will guide you, or whatever. 440 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:27,880 And then you don't tell that player that they're in fact 441 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:29,660 playing a schizophrenic player who will [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 442 00:21:29,660 --> 00:21:30,080 these things. 443 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,629 And then you use some sort of live-action role playing or 444 00:21:32,629 --> 00:21:36,310 not, I'm not exactly sure, but this other guy is convinced 445 00:21:36,310 --> 00:21:38,995 that this is what the game is about. 446 00:21:38,995 --> 00:21:40,610 PROFESSOR: I could write a [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 447 00:21:40,610 --> 00:21:42,410 rivals scenario. 448 00:21:42,410 --> 00:21:46,364 The player's don't know that going in, but folks have seen 449 00:21:46,364 --> 00:21:49,352 the film The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari. 450 00:21:49,352 --> 00:21:51,620 It's an old German expressionist [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 451 00:21:51,620 --> 00:21:53,290 film. 452 00:21:53,290 --> 00:21:54,476 I could spoil it? 453 00:21:54,476 --> 00:21:56,221 Does anyone care? 454 00:21:56,221 --> 00:21:59,960 It's an old 1920s. 455 00:21:59,960 --> 00:22:02,020 AUDIENCE: I think you're fine. 456 00:22:02,020 --> 00:22:05,160 PROFESSOR: But the basic idea comes down to the hero of the 457 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,450 horror story is actually just a patient in 458 00:22:07,450 --> 00:22:08,700 a psychiatric ward. 459 00:22:11,930 --> 00:22:18,310 And everybody who he believes is part of the story he's 460 00:22:18,310 --> 00:22:20,720 conquering is somebody else in the psychiatric ward. 461 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:23,800 The big villain is actually the person running the ward. 462 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:24,730 AUDIENCE: That's like Shutter Island. 463 00:22:24,730 --> 00:22:27,130 AUDIENCE: Yeah, it's like Shutter Island 464 00:22:27,130 --> 00:22:31,050 PROFESSOR: Not entirely unlike a lot of different stories. 465 00:22:31,050 --> 00:22:37,080 But similar idea of the information being given is not 466 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:38,740 to be trusted. 467 00:22:38,740 --> 00:22:41,490 AUDIENCE: Something to go along like that, a game 468 00:22:41,490 --> 00:22:43,420 mechanic for that would be everyone's assigned a 469 00:22:43,420 --> 00:22:44,230 different role. 470 00:22:44,230 --> 00:22:46,820 And one of those roles is patient. 471 00:22:46,820 --> 00:22:49,820 So you don't know if you're the patient or not. 472 00:22:49,820 --> 00:22:51,845 And so in time as you do your objectives, and as you play 473 00:22:51,845 --> 00:22:56,200 along you may start to realize things aren't 474 00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:58,515 actually as they seem. 475 00:22:58,515 --> 00:22:59,556 So eventually you may figure out I'm 476 00:22:59,556 --> 00:23:00,830 actually the patient here. 477 00:23:00,830 --> 00:23:04,120 PROFESSOR: Right, almost like primeval 478 00:23:04,120 --> 00:23:06,500 authority in that sense. 479 00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:08,620 AUDIENCE: Going along with that, I think an interesting 480 00:23:08,620 --> 00:23:13,260 mechanic would be like the Battlestar Gallactica. 481 00:23:13,260 --> 00:23:15,710 The person knows that they're a Cylon but they can 482 00:23:15,710 --> 00:23:18,330 infiltrate by doing that voting system at the end. 483 00:23:18,330 --> 00:23:20,282 What is that? 484 00:23:20,282 --> 00:23:21,750 The [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 485 00:23:21,750 --> 00:23:25,141 So you know that someone's trying to sabotage you but you 486 00:23:25,141 --> 00:23:26,391 don't know who. 487 00:23:30,470 --> 00:23:32,580 PROFESSOR: So that's who's the patient from a 488 00:23:32,580 --> 00:23:33,310 different way, right? 489 00:23:33,310 --> 00:23:39,040 One is, player knows who-- 490 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:42,272 at least one person knows and the other one is trying to 491 00:23:42,272 --> 00:23:44,445 figure out whether they are it. 492 00:23:47,270 --> 00:23:48,520 [INAUDIBLE]. 493 00:23:53,222 --> 00:23:55,035 AUDIENCE: This is just an interesting mechanic. 494 00:23:55,035 --> 00:23:58,390 There was this RPG called, Great [INAUDIBLE] 495 00:23:58,390 --> 00:24:02,760 Game that had this really interesting mechanic for 496 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:04,830 handling the dark side that each player had. 497 00:24:04,830 --> 00:24:07,150 Which might be relevant in this situation. 498 00:24:07,150 --> 00:24:10,560 Essentially you had a different person who's also 499 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:14,440 playing another protagonist also play your antagonist. 500 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,740 And so, they would either talk to you and tell you things or 501 00:24:17,740 --> 00:24:20,485 they would just directly control your character like if 502 00:24:20,485 --> 00:24:23,070 you fail at the composure role. 503 00:24:23,070 --> 00:24:26,850 And taking the adversarial side of your character away 504 00:24:26,850 --> 00:24:33,060 from your control, it means that your character is more 505 00:24:33,060 --> 00:24:35,220 likely to behave in a really disruptive way. 506 00:24:35,220 --> 00:24:38,080 Rather than just a controllably disruptive way 507 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,870 would be if you had a vested interest in your character. 508 00:24:41,870 --> 00:24:46,430 PROFESSOR: So, open end case control of your character. 509 00:24:46,430 --> 00:24:48,606 And that might work really well with some of the ideas of 510 00:24:48,606 --> 00:24:51,534 the good cop bad cop idea that someone thought of already. 511 00:25:02,270 --> 00:25:07,120 AUDIENCE: So, actually going off of the audio idea of 512 00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:11,115 someone is actually hearing voices? 513 00:25:11,115 --> 00:25:12,930 If it was the patient thing. 514 00:25:12,930 --> 00:25:16,290 You could actually have things where you have one player is 515 00:25:16,290 --> 00:25:19,240 actually playing a patient who is schizophrenic and another 516 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,750 player is playing the voices in his head. 517 00:25:21,750 --> 00:25:24,140 But they don't really know that. 518 00:25:24,140 --> 00:25:28,560 They are playing the scenario where they have some delusion 519 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,310 that they're trapped in whatever. 520 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:38,460 So having a person actually being the-- 521 00:25:38,460 --> 00:25:41,830 as you're saying-- having an actual person be the dark side 522 00:25:41,830 --> 00:25:43,340 of the patient. 523 00:25:46,422 --> 00:25:49,700 PROFESSOR: But neither of them know who's the dark side? 524 00:25:49,700 --> 00:25:53,300 AUDIENCE: The patient, yeah, you could have it. 525 00:25:53,300 --> 00:25:55,310 AUDIENCE: One way you could arbitrate it is you could say, 526 00:25:55,310 --> 00:25:57,560 the patient player is just basically able 527 00:25:57,560 --> 00:25:58,510 to do as they please. 528 00:25:58,510 --> 00:26:02,920 But there are rules which govern whether the dark side 529 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:04,170 character can take over. 530 00:26:06,740 --> 00:26:10,540 And that means that the patient is genuinely driven by 531 00:26:10,540 --> 00:26:13,150 trying to reach a compromise but they can just be overruled 532 00:26:13,150 --> 00:26:15,770 by the dark side. 533 00:26:15,770 --> 00:26:18,750 AUDIENCE: There could also be things where it could be more 534 00:26:18,750 --> 00:26:20,080 like a strong role-playing thing? 535 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,400 Where the voice is actually just trying to convince them 536 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,720 that yes, this delusion is real. 537 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,400 PROFESSOR: So, do you still think you 538 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:27,495 have a recorded thing? 539 00:26:27,495 --> 00:26:29,320 Or two different? 540 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:30,480 AUDIENCE: You could actually have two people just actually 541 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,850 standing there talking. 542 00:26:32,850 --> 00:26:36,640 PROFESSOR: So two people playing one character at once. 543 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:39,140 AUDIENCE: It would potentially require a lot of suspension of 544 00:26:39,140 --> 00:26:41,500 disbelief on the part of the person playing the 545 00:26:41,500 --> 00:26:41,870 psychiatrist. 546 00:26:41,870 --> 00:26:44,940 PROFESSOR: It might be one of those things that's easier to 547 00:26:44,940 --> 00:26:50,336 mediate by having people talk on screen or 548 00:26:50,336 --> 00:26:53,312 something like that? 549 00:26:53,312 --> 00:26:55,296 Or a microphone in a speaker type thing? 550 00:26:55,296 --> 00:26:56,546 [INAUDIBLE PHRASE] 551 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,496 I've not seen many games that are designed specifically to 552 00:27:01,496 --> 00:27:03,460 be played on the [INAUDIBLE] 553 00:27:03,460 --> 00:27:05,960 function. 554 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:07,466 AUDIENCE: I definitely like that idea, and I think it 555 00:27:07,466 --> 00:27:08,760 could work well in a card game as well. 556 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,340 If you have two players sharing the same hand, and the 557 00:27:11,340 --> 00:27:13,950 player who actually gets to play the cards from the hand 558 00:27:13,950 --> 00:27:16,610 is whoever's in control of the patient. 559 00:27:16,610 --> 00:27:21,580 And so the state basically changes depending on what the 560 00:27:21,580 --> 00:27:22,690 doctor does. 561 00:27:22,690 --> 00:27:26,110 Different players come in control of the patient's hand. 562 00:27:26,110 --> 00:27:28,300 PROFESSOR: So it seems like we actually have a lot of 563 00:27:28,300 --> 00:27:32,740 different options on how we could mechanic someone who's 564 00:27:32,740 --> 00:27:33,990 going to be unstable. 565 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,237 And also, a bunch of ideas on how that state switch could 566 00:27:39,237 --> 00:27:42,950 happen or what makes it take over. 567 00:27:42,950 --> 00:27:44,270 So that's pretty cool. 568 00:27:44,270 --> 00:27:49,170 And that's not mutually exclusive from any other ideas 569 00:27:49,170 --> 00:27:49,930 that are specifically about the patient 570 00:27:49,930 --> 00:27:51,430 and the doctor, right? 571 00:27:51,430 --> 00:27:55,570 So we're talking about what happens to the patient. 572 00:27:55,570 --> 00:27:57,610 These are the rules a patient could be operating under. 573 00:27:57,610 --> 00:27:59,176 The doctor could have a different set of rules. 574 00:28:01,860 --> 00:28:05,286 AUDIENCE: I was reading about this, and I think that it 575 00:28:05,286 --> 00:28:09,970 turns out most violence in psychiatric wards happens to 576 00:28:09,970 --> 00:28:13,130 the patients themselves or to other patients by patients. 577 00:28:13,130 --> 00:28:18,270 Much more than it actually happens towards practitioners. 578 00:28:18,270 --> 00:28:21,780 And I'm just noticing that I don't think any of our ideas 579 00:28:21,780 --> 00:28:24,560 address any of those issues. 580 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:28,570 PROFESSOR: Ward management maybe gets a little closer. 581 00:28:28,570 --> 00:28:31,410 AUDIENCE: People start turning on themselves. 582 00:28:31,410 --> 00:28:34,160 And I was just thinking another possible way you could 583 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,230 apply a lot of these role-playing multiple role 584 00:28:37,230 --> 00:28:40,310 auditory mechanics is to a situation. 585 00:28:40,310 --> 00:28:44,490 We should probably do research in what situations lead to 586 00:28:44,490 --> 00:28:48,025 patients coming in contact with each other and the 587 00:28:48,025 --> 00:28:49,980 encounter turning violent. 588 00:28:49,980 --> 00:28:51,940 And all players be patients that have various different 589 00:28:51,940 --> 00:28:56,140 mental disorders, and just to help you understand as a 590 00:28:56,140 --> 00:28:58,840 patient what kinds of behaviors and situations would 591 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:03,450 lead you to going violent on someone else. 592 00:29:03,450 --> 00:29:05,870 Just like one of those, be in someone else's shoes helps you 593 00:29:05,870 --> 00:29:07,300 understand the situation better. 594 00:29:07,300 --> 00:29:12,520 PROFESSOR: So we're just putting them in an environment 595 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,857 where everything that is necessary for a different 596 00:29:16,857 --> 00:29:21,828 character to become upset and violent and just see how it 597 00:29:21,828 --> 00:29:22,784 naturally occurs. 598 00:29:22,784 --> 00:29:24,034 [INAUDIBLE]. 599 00:29:26,620 --> 00:29:27,990 OK. 600 00:29:27,990 --> 00:29:30,500 AUDIENCE: They gave a persuasion that's a cross 601 00:29:30,500 --> 00:29:32,500 between BS and Uno. 602 00:29:32,500 --> 00:29:34,280 So you have two doctors who are trying to get rid of cards 603 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:38,560 in their hand, and the patient wants a certain set of cards. 604 00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:40,985 And he's saying, I'm looking for John. 605 00:29:40,985 --> 00:29:45,182 And the two doctors pull out a hard and say, oh this is John. 606 00:29:45,182 --> 00:29:46,829 Or they can be like, oh this isn't John but I can 607 00:29:46,829 --> 00:29:48,079 help you out later. 608 00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:54,496 PROFESSOR: That almost seems like it's intended to teach 609 00:29:54,496 --> 00:29:55,490 people about lying. 610 00:29:55,490 --> 00:29:56,981 AUDIENCE: Yes. 611 00:29:56,981 --> 00:30:02,448 PROFESSOR: So, I'm going to say it's almost 612 00:30:02,448 --> 00:30:04,436 like BS and Go Fish. 613 00:30:17,358 --> 00:30:20,360 So we have a pretty good pile here. 614 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:25,860 A lot of these can obviously be combined. 615 00:30:25,860 --> 00:30:28,890 And there's no reason why multiple groups couldn't 616 00:30:28,890 --> 00:30:30,940 attempt to do similar topics. 617 00:30:30,940 --> 00:30:34,295 In fact, you could take exactly the same set and I'm 618 00:30:34,295 --> 00:30:36,760 pretty sure you're going to [INAUDIBLE]. 619 00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:38,346 So that's fine. 620 00:30:38,346 --> 00:30:42,420 Again, a lot of things that could probably be easier done 621 00:30:42,420 --> 00:30:43,200 live-action. 622 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:46,280 Or easier to do a prototype live-action. 623 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:53,020 The folks who were here on Monday, they are actually 624 00:30:53,020 --> 00:30:58,912 focused mostly on trying to see what could be moved out to 625 00:30:58,912 --> 00:31:03,180 more resonant things in the future. 626 00:31:03,180 --> 00:31:04,785 Your games don't necessarily need to do that. 627 00:31:04,785 --> 00:31:08,910 But you might want to keep that in mind. 628 00:31:08,910 --> 00:31:12,834 Because this assignment is a game for a client after all. 629 00:31:12,834 --> 00:31:15,750 And if you manage to address that need-- 630 00:31:15,750 --> 00:31:18,880 here's something that doesn't require one person from the 631 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:20,477 original GM team. 632 00:31:24,149 --> 00:31:28,620 You can imagine the acting exercise that we ran through, 633 00:31:28,620 --> 00:31:30,930 beyond talented improvising on their feet. 634 00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:40,456 Requires people and requires responses that may not 635 00:31:40,456 --> 00:31:44,963 necessarily every gaming environment's going to have. 636 00:31:44,963 --> 00:31:48,330 Something that can be turned into a very understandable set 637 00:31:48,330 --> 00:31:52,974 of rules or using technologies that are very accessible. 638 00:31:52,974 --> 00:31:56,132 They're going to play your voice and its going to be a 639 00:31:56,132 --> 00:32:00,102 lot easier than something like formulas or something like a 640 00:32:00,102 --> 00:32:04,638 phone as opposed to [INAUDIBLE]. 641 00:32:04,638 --> 00:32:07,730 AUDIENCE: It was a phone conversation actually going? 642 00:32:07,730 --> 00:32:10,244 So if it's live, and people are in different rooms, and 643 00:32:10,244 --> 00:32:12,584 actually talking to each other over the phone or Skype or 644 00:32:12,584 --> 00:32:13,172 something like that. 645 00:32:13,172 --> 00:32:14,980 But you're talking to someone? 646 00:32:14,980 --> 00:32:17,159 You have the phone-ups and then that other person can 647 00:32:17,159 --> 00:32:19,270 hear what you're saying and be the evil voice? 648 00:32:21,870 --> 00:32:23,229 PROFESSOR: That's the thing, you don't even 649 00:32:23,229 --> 00:32:23,850 need to do it on Skype. 650 00:32:23,850 --> 00:32:26,830 You just get two cell phones with [INTERPOSING VOICES] 651 00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:33,140 Now, the technology just becomes that much easier for 652 00:32:33,140 --> 00:32:34,390 games [INAUDIBLE PHRASE]. 653 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:43,320 AUDIENCE: Or you could make it like if there's some game that 654 00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:44,100 two people are playing. 655 00:32:44,100 --> 00:32:46,120 The two groups that are playing the same game but they 656 00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:47,530 both hear the other group. 657 00:32:47,530 --> 00:32:49,230 Like this group would hear the other 658 00:32:49,230 --> 00:32:50,970 group's playing the game. 659 00:32:50,970 --> 00:32:52,725 So it's not even just a random conversation. 660 00:32:52,725 --> 00:32:55,048 They're playing the same game you're playing but you're 661 00:32:55,048 --> 00:32:56,950 hearing them play games. 662 00:32:56,950 --> 00:32:59,390 PROFESSOR: Wow. 663 00:32:59,390 --> 00:33:00,845 Wow. 664 00:33:00,845 --> 00:33:01,611 AUDIENCE: That's deep. 665 00:33:01,611 --> 00:33:06,030 PROFESSOR: I could say two groups 666 00:33:06,030 --> 00:33:07,280 eavesdropping same game. 667 00:33:10,940 --> 00:33:15,562 AUDIENCE: I just wanted to say that I think the thing which 668 00:33:15,562 --> 00:33:19,496 is really hard if you're working with people who like 669 00:33:19,496 --> 00:33:23,384 don't really want to do a role-playing thing is building 670 00:33:23,384 --> 00:33:28,990 a level of emotional intensity and the fear of violence. 671 00:33:28,990 --> 00:33:31,194 Which is the point of the training. 672 00:33:31,194 --> 00:33:34,330 They want them to be able to deal with that kind of 673 00:33:34,330 --> 00:33:37,520 emotional stress on your feet. 674 00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:39,620 So I was just wondering. 675 00:33:39,620 --> 00:33:41,460 Because I don't have any good ideas. 676 00:33:41,460 --> 00:33:44,554 Can anyone think of something which works out? 677 00:33:44,554 --> 00:33:45,891 AUDIENCE: Which could genuinely create a situation 678 00:33:45,891 --> 00:33:48,186 where one could be afraid of violence? 679 00:33:48,186 --> 00:33:51,138 AUDIENCE: Without actually having to 680 00:33:51,138 --> 00:33:53,620 threaten another person. 681 00:33:53,620 --> 00:33:56,260 AUDIENCE: I don't think you're going to be able to do that. 682 00:33:56,260 --> 00:34:02,750 AUDIENCE: Well, if one player's role is actually not 683 00:34:02,750 --> 00:34:06,160 to understand but to provide the experience for the other? 684 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:09,090 And they are hearing the recording that's giving them 685 00:34:09,090 --> 00:34:12,250 cues as to what to do? 686 00:34:12,250 --> 00:34:13,679 And the other player's not agreed to this, and one of 687 00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:17,952 their cues is like and now, grab the other player by the 688 00:34:17,952 --> 00:34:20,949 shoulders and shake them violently and say something. 689 00:34:20,949 --> 00:34:23,575 You could possibly create a situation where 690 00:34:23,575 --> 00:34:26,284 you're like, whoa. 691 00:34:26,284 --> 00:34:27,449 AUDIENCE: The problem is you have to be able to get 692 00:34:27,449 --> 00:34:30,097 somebody who can do that without cracking up in the 693 00:34:30,097 --> 00:34:30,639 middle of it. 694 00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,790 Because people do that when they're nervous and 695 00:34:33,790 --> 00:34:35,710 uncomfortable. 696 00:34:35,710 --> 00:34:37,170 So you'd pretty much be reduced to finding 697 00:34:37,170 --> 00:34:39,060 professional actors. 698 00:34:39,060 --> 00:34:42,676 And that's a limited resource that puts a limitation on how 699 00:34:42,676 --> 00:34:43,911 widespread your game is. 700 00:34:43,911 --> 00:34:45,887 PROFESSOR: Even people who are [INAUDIBLE]. 701 00:34:49,345 --> 00:34:52,556 AUDIENCE: I had a thought where you have a patient to 702 00:34:52,556 --> 00:34:53,791 patient interaction. 703 00:34:53,791 --> 00:34:55,521 So you have two people in different rooms on the phone 704 00:34:55,521 --> 00:34:59,460 with each other trying to negotiate something. 705 00:34:59,460 --> 00:35:01,264 I don't know what it would be. 706 00:35:01,264 --> 00:35:04,228 AUDIENCE: And some other people in each of their rooms 707 00:35:04,228 --> 00:35:07,192 that are talking in their ear and trying to distract them 708 00:35:07,192 --> 00:35:08,180 from the conversation. 709 00:35:08,180 --> 00:35:13,120 PROFESSOR: OK, so patient talks to patient. 710 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:15,096 AUDIENCE: Maybe it could be something like they're trying 711 00:35:15,096 --> 00:35:16,578 to negotiate [INAUDIBLE]. 712 00:35:20,530 --> 00:35:23,000 PROFESSOR: With voices in-person? 713 00:35:28,930 --> 00:35:33,258 There is a specific article on schizophrenia that I uploaded 714 00:35:33,258 --> 00:35:34,719 in your resources. 715 00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:35,969 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 716 00:35:41,050 --> 00:35:43,972 Patrick first, then Michelle? 717 00:35:43,972 --> 00:35:46,200 AUDIENCE: So I was thinking something along the lines of 718 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:46,540 Battleship? 719 00:35:46,540 --> 00:35:49,445 If you have a doctor player and a patient player and 720 00:35:49,445 --> 00:35:53,860 they're both looking at their own version of the same board. 721 00:35:53,860 --> 00:35:58,640 And if the patient wants to get from one end to the other 722 00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,245 and the doctor has to allow whether or not they can make 723 00:36:01,245 --> 00:36:01,920 their move. 724 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:04,970 But on the doctor's board they have different obstacles. 725 00:36:04,970 --> 00:36:07,306 And so the patient will say, I want to move 726 00:36:07,306 --> 00:36:07,540 from here to here. 727 00:36:07,540 --> 00:36:09,300 And the doctor says, I can't let you do that. 728 00:36:09,300 --> 00:36:11,490 I can let you go from here to here. 729 00:36:11,490 --> 00:36:13,590 It'd be a game about compromise. 730 00:36:13,590 --> 00:36:19,306 PROFESSOR: OK, so sort of a doctor mediated 731 00:36:19,306 --> 00:36:20,556 [UNINTELLIGIBLE PHRASE]. 732 00:36:27,810 --> 00:36:32,003 And the Battleship analogy is good to help us remember where 733 00:36:32,003 --> 00:36:34,220 the idea came from. 734 00:36:34,220 --> 00:36:35,170 Michelle? 735 00:36:35,170 --> 00:36:38,030 AUDIENCE: Yeah, so just something that Owen said about 736 00:36:38,030 --> 00:36:39,890 trying to simulate fear. 737 00:36:39,890 --> 00:36:43,060 I mean, if you can add time pressure to any game then I 738 00:36:43,060 --> 00:36:48,615 think that strong of a stress situation can almost be fear. 739 00:36:48,615 --> 00:36:49,895 It can get [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. 740 00:36:49,895 --> 00:36:54,363 PROFESSOR: Because what you're really going for is stress in 741 00:36:54,363 --> 00:36:55,000 making decisions. 742 00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:57,876 AUDIENCE: [UNINTELLIGIBLE] created stress without the 743 00:36:57,876 --> 00:36:59,126 [INTERPOSING VOICES] 744 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:08,190 AUDIENCE: So, an idea of how to take the doctor mediated 745 00:37:08,190 --> 00:37:11,250 board movement into the real world? 746 00:37:11,250 --> 00:37:13,900 We're talking about these phone to phone conversations. 747 00:37:13,900 --> 00:37:19,340 You could have the patient in a room but he's blindfolded. 748 00:37:19,340 --> 00:37:22,210 And he's trying to move through the room towards an 749 00:37:22,210 --> 00:37:23,320 exit in the room or something. 750 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:25,920 And the doctor has some limited information about the 751 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,700 room and has to help him navigate through the room. 752 00:37:29,700 --> 00:37:32,740 And he'll say, I want to move forward. 753 00:37:32,740 --> 00:37:36,460 And he'll say, well I can't really let you do that because 754 00:37:36,460 --> 00:37:38,910 there's a pit fill of spikes in front of you. 755 00:37:38,910 --> 00:37:40,740 And you wouldn't necessarily actually have a real pit full 756 00:37:40,740 --> 00:37:41,160 of spikes in front of them. 757 00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,020 But that kind of thing where you're trying to gather 758 00:37:44,020 --> 00:37:46,690 information and help them through this. 759 00:37:46,690 --> 00:37:50,540 And you could put time pressure on it and say, well I 760 00:37:50,540 --> 00:37:54,205 have to make a decision now because he wants to move now. 761 00:37:54,205 --> 00:37:57,165 But I might accidentally move him into an obstacle and have 762 00:37:57,165 --> 00:37:59,750 to deal with that. 763 00:37:59,750 --> 00:38:03,030 PROFESSOR: You could have a thing where there are some 764 00:38:03,030 --> 00:38:09,060 things that the patient needs to do that the patient can't 765 00:38:09,060 --> 00:38:11,407 talk about. 766 00:38:11,407 --> 00:38:15,074 And it might be something like the patient has to move every 767 00:38:15,074 --> 00:38:15,808 10 minutes. 768 00:38:15,808 --> 00:38:16,297 And only the patient knows this. 769 00:38:16,297 --> 00:38:17,770 The doctor doesn't. 770 00:38:17,770 --> 00:38:20,710 AUDIENCE: The patient has a fear of moving to the left. 771 00:38:20,710 --> 00:38:22,315 PROFESSOR: Or something like that. 772 00:38:22,315 --> 00:38:22,750 AUDIENCE: Things like that. 773 00:38:22,750 --> 00:38:23,620 PROFESSOR: Patient has to move left, right. 774 00:38:23,620 --> 00:38:26,820 AUDIENCE: I think it also emphasizes the thing they were 775 00:38:26,820 --> 00:38:28,850 talking about on Monday in that you are 776 00:38:28,850 --> 00:38:32,370 both trying to not-- 777 00:38:32,370 --> 00:38:35,840 if it escalates to the point where violence happens-- 778 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:38,270 you're both trying to not let yourself get hurt but you're 779 00:38:38,270 --> 00:38:40,790 also trying to not hurt them. 780 00:38:40,790 --> 00:38:43,810 And I think incorporating that in some way might be cool. 781 00:38:43,810 --> 00:38:47,290 PROFESSOR: Definitely a lot of these ideas are sort of 782 00:38:47,290 --> 00:38:51,010 mechanicing the patient's limitations are really, 783 00:38:51,010 --> 00:38:52,250 really, cool. 784 00:38:52,250 --> 00:38:55,700 But again, remember the audience is the residents. 785 00:38:55,700 --> 00:38:57,910 So understanding what a patient is 786 00:38:57,910 --> 00:39:00,168 going through is useful. 787 00:39:00,168 --> 00:39:04,309 But also thinking of rules that help a resident 788 00:39:04,309 --> 00:39:07,385 understand what they can do is also really important. 789 00:39:07,385 --> 00:39:09,114 So don't just think about throwing a ton of limitations 790 00:39:09,114 --> 00:39:12,986 on them without also given them a release. 791 00:39:12,986 --> 00:39:14,922 Things that they can actively do. 792 00:39:14,922 --> 00:39:16,858 Words that they can carry out. 793 00:39:16,858 --> 00:39:20,488 AUDIENCE: So, working off the time pressure thing, I think 794 00:39:20,488 --> 00:39:23,700 that it might make sense for these kinds of escalation, 795 00:39:23,700 --> 00:39:28,470 negotiation type, situations for the person who's 796 00:39:28,470 --> 00:39:32,600 controlling the patient to know what their triggers are. 797 00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:37,390 And every time a bad thing is said, they just reduce the 798 00:39:37,390 --> 00:39:40,555 amount of time that the doctor has to deal with them. 799 00:39:40,555 --> 00:39:45,400 And they say that, they just say minus 10 seconds. 800 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,015 And they have a timer and it ticks down to reach the 801 00:39:48,015 --> 00:39:50,600 conclusion of the doctor getting them to where they 802 00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:53,166 want to be. 803 00:39:53,166 --> 00:39:56,060 And rather than like raising their voice, or being 804 00:39:56,060 --> 00:40:00,229 physically in some way, they just adjust a timer. 805 00:40:00,229 --> 00:40:03,652 And when it gets down to zero it's over. 806 00:40:03,652 --> 00:40:05,608 PROFESSOR: I can see that. 807 00:40:05,608 --> 00:40:06,858 [UNINTELLIGIBLE PHRASE] 808 00:40:14,900 --> 00:40:16,720 AUDIENCE: I'd just like to say, one way you could make 809 00:40:16,720 --> 00:40:18,860 your players feel pressure is to give them a really flat 810 00:40:18,860 --> 00:40:20,870 goal hierarchy. 811 00:40:20,870 --> 00:40:21,160 Right? 812 00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,250 So a good example is Missile Command. 813 00:40:24,250 --> 00:40:25,930 Does everyone know that game? 814 00:40:25,930 --> 00:40:27,440 Missile Command is just six cities. 815 00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:29,020 And there's missiles coming in and you have to 816 00:40:29,020 --> 00:40:29,930 shoot them all down. 817 00:40:29,930 --> 00:40:32,460 And each city is equally valuable. 818 00:40:32,460 --> 00:40:37,920 So if you lose one you're in a drastically reduced position. 819 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,870 Whereas games that tend to have a more structured goal 820 00:40:40,870 --> 00:40:44,570 hierarchy basically means you can afford a loss. 821 00:40:44,570 --> 00:40:44,900 Right? 822 00:40:44,900 --> 00:40:46,440 So like chess is a good example. 823 00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:48,450 Where you can say, OK I can afford to lose this. 824 00:40:48,450 --> 00:40:51,720 Whereas in Missile Command you can't afford to lose anything. 825 00:40:51,720 --> 00:40:56,832 So by really capping what the player has, what they can 826 00:40:56,832 --> 00:41:00,340 afford to lose, and then making sure that all of their 827 00:41:00,340 --> 00:41:03,260 goals have equal value, that means that every loss and 828 00:41:03,260 --> 00:41:06,400 every failure is felt much more strongly. 829 00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:11,250 And I felt like, Dion when you were doing your role play, 830 00:41:11,250 --> 00:41:14,932 there was this sense, especially coming from Caesar, 831 00:41:14,932 --> 00:41:19,010 that any one thing that goes wrong is really bad. 832 00:41:19,010 --> 00:41:21,260 There's a really thin line there. 833 00:41:21,260 --> 00:41:23,150 PROFESSOR: That's especially applicable when talking about 834 00:41:23,150 --> 00:41:25,020 the doctor's goals, not necessarily 835 00:41:25,020 --> 00:41:26,430 the patient's goals. 836 00:41:26,430 --> 00:41:28,820 AUDIENCE: I mean, from the doctors' position right? 837 00:41:28,820 --> 00:41:31,711 You can't really afford a lot of mistakes in these 838 00:41:31,711 --> 00:41:32,961 situations. 839 00:41:37,612 --> 00:41:40,738 AUDIENCE: I'm kind of aghast, but I was listening to what 840 00:41:40,738 --> 00:41:45,700 you were saying and I have a thought on how to combine lots 841 00:41:45,700 --> 00:41:47,895 of these different ideas. 842 00:41:47,895 --> 00:41:50,800 I'm envisioning a game where there'd be two types of 843 00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:52,320 players, like you were 844 00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,680 mentioning, doctors and patients. 845 00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:58,180 And there'd be one doctor and multiple patients. 846 00:41:58,180 --> 00:42:00,950 It would be a turn based game where you go around and give 847 00:42:00,950 --> 00:42:01,950 each person a turn. 848 00:42:01,950 --> 00:42:04,500 The doctor would always be in relationship to each 849 00:42:04,500 --> 00:42:06,210 individual one. 850 00:42:06,210 --> 00:42:11,100 And limited vocabulary I thought was important, taking 851 00:42:11,100 --> 00:42:12,660 that from a couple of the ideas. 852 00:42:12,660 --> 00:42:14,950 The patient and the doctor each have their own set of 853 00:42:14,950 --> 00:42:16,970 vocabularies and the clash of that would 854 00:42:16,970 --> 00:42:20,380 introduce mechanic there. 855 00:42:20,380 --> 00:42:25,375 Where the patient has their own vocabulary describing to 856 00:42:25,375 --> 00:42:28,030 the doctor what they like, what they don't like. 857 00:42:28,030 --> 00:42:29,240 They know what they like. 858 00:42:29,240 --> 00:42:37,510 You could extract it to describe anything the doctor 859 00:42:37,510 --> 00:42:39,090 would have in their vocabulary. 860 00:42:39,090 --> 00:42:43,072 So, as one example the doctor could give the patient a card 861 00:42:43,072 --> 00:42:45,530 with a shape or some item on it. 862 00:42:45,530 --> 00:42:48,920 And the item has attributes like color, shape, something 863 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:51,190 that somebody could like or dislike. 864 00:42:51,190 --> 00:42:56,820 In their list they could look at this and see one of these 865 00:42:56,820 --> 00:43:00,450 things clashes with something in my list of dislikes. 866 00:43:00,450 --> 00:43:01,460 I don't like that card. 867 00:43:01,460 --> 00:43:05,760 I'm going to escalate my anger, my displeasure, with 868 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:07,170 the situation. 869 00:43:07,170 --> 00:43:10,480 And so, the doctor has a limited amount of time to deal 870 00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:12,270 with each patient. 871 00:43:12,270 --> 00:43:16,800 As the patient's escalation increases, they have less and 872 00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:18,250 less time to be dealt with. 873 00:43:18,250 --> 00:43:21,460 After a certain point the doctor loses that patient, so 874 00:43:21,460 --> 00:43:24,300 you have that loss brought in. 875 00:43:24,300 --> 00:43:27,860 And then after all the patients have been lost the 876 00:43:27,860 --> 00:43:29,050 game is over. 877 00:43:29,050 --> 00:43:32,050 The way that it would be won is that the doctor is 878 00:43:32,050 --> 00:43:34,180 discovering the profile of each patient. 879 00:43:34,180 --> 00:43:39,043 Because they are trying to, like in a normal setting or a 880 00:43:39,043 --> 00:43:42,150 real world setting, you're trying to discover the profile 881 00:43:42,150 --> 00:43:46,620 that allows the doctor to deal with the patient in the best 882 00:43:46,620 --> 00:43:49,140 possible way so that they aren't violent. 883 00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:57,623 PROFESSOR: So that seems to play off the patient and 884 00:43:57,623 --> 00:44:01,487 doctor have different rules and triggers. 885 00:44:01,487 --> 00:44:04,481 You've got a situation where, in what you're suggesting, you 886 00:44:04,481 --> 00:44:07,770 have one doctor and multiple patients. 887 00:44:07,770 --> 00:44:08,970 Which is accurate. 888 00:44:08,970 --> 00:44:11,620 I'm not quite sure that they'd be dealing with them 889 00:44:11,620 --> 00:44:13,310 simultaneously but it might not matter for the 890 00:44:13,310 --> 00:44:14,560 purposes of the game. 891 00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:24,690 It might be like those improv games where you manage to 892 00:44:24,690 --> 00:44:30,720 figure out before time runs out what a 893 00:44:30,720 --> 00:44:31,870 person's profile is. 894 00:44:31,870 --> 00:44:35,510 That could be the win condition. 895 00:44:35,510 --> 00:44:37,450 So it's equal win [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 896 00:44:37,450 --> 00:44:40,649 and equal loss if you don't actually get it incorporated 897 00:44:40,649 --> 00:44:44,416 with something like you give a trigger and reduce the amount 898 00:44:44,416 --> 00:44:46,146 of time you have available, the number of turns available. 899 00:44:46,146 --> 00:44:47,628 It doesn't have to be real time. 900 00:44:54,544 --> 00:44:55,794 So you can use it with multiple patients. 901 00:45:00,472 --> 00:45:05,310 So that doesn't even necessarily have to deal with 902 00:45:05,310 --> 00:45:09,050 talking about actual psychiatric ward situations. 903 00:45:09,050 --> 00:45:13,048 That could be something like objects and colors. 904 00:45:13,048 --> 00:45:14,860 It's more of a guessing game. 905 00:45:14,860 --> 00:45:18,480 That might be too abstract, possibly, because in the end 906 00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:23,490 you want people to be able to tie it back to the experience. 907 00:45:23,490 --> 00:45:26,350 To be able to make an easy connection to what it's like 908 00:45:26,350 --> 00:45:27,770 to be a resident or what it's going to be 909 00:45:27,770 --> 00:45:29,860 like to be a resident. 910 00:45:29,860 --> 00:45:36,310 So this is where the theme needs to be pretty clear. 911 00:45:36,310 --> 00:45:37,350 But in [UNINTELLIGIBLE] 912 00:45:37,350 --> 00:45:39,556 talked, fear is not meaning. 913 00:45:39,556 --> 00:45:43,900 Meaning is also tied pretty well with your mechanics. 914 00:45:43,900 --> 00:45:47,310 So that's just something to keep in mind. 915 00:45:53,240 --> 00:45:55,470 OK? 916 00:45:55,470 --> 00:45:59,692 PROFESSOR: We probably have another half-an-hour class. 917 00:45:59,692 --> 00:46:04,570 I think the plan was just to let everyone figure out teams 918 00:46:04,570 --> 00:46:06,500 you wanted to be in. 919 00:46:06,500 --> 00:46:12,660 This is going to be class time to talk to each other and see 920 00:46:12,660 --> 00:46:15,770 if there's stuff in here that people are 921 00:46:15,770 --> 00:46:17,280 really psyched about. 922 00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:20,190 Is there anyone in this class that's already like, this is 923 00:46:20,190 --> 00:46:21,440 something I really want to do? 924 00:46:23,845 --> 00:46:25,855 AUDIENCE: Well, my preference is towards the ward advantage. 925 00:46:28,710 --> 00:46:29,960 To ward advantage? 926 00:46:38,766 --> 00:46:41,256 PROFESSOR: I don't really have a plan [INAUDIBLE]. 927 00:46:41,256 --> 00:46:45,120 AUDIENCE: I'd be interested in voices and hidden information. 928 00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:49,860 So fooling players and that result in them behaving in 929 00:46:49,860 --> 00:46:51,220 erratic ways. 930 00:46:51,220 --> 00:46:53,700 And as from the point of view of other players, and then the 931 00:46:53,700 --> 00:46:55,080 point of view of player's behaving erratically, other 932 00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:56,336 players are behaving erratically because it's not 933 00:46:56,336 --> 00:46:59,140 in line with what they think is actually going on. 934 00:46:59,140 --> 00:47:02,398 Or voices, or both, or something like that. 935 00:47:02,398 --> 00:47:04,039 PROFESSOR: So that's the general territory you're 936 00:47:04,039 --> 00:47:06,150 interested in going into? 937 00:47:06,150 --> 00:47:08,026 Who wants to? 938 00:47:08,026 --> 00:47:09,490 AUDIENCE: I'm very interested in the escalation and 939 00:47:09,490 --> 00:47:11,200 de-escalation by hidden keywords. 940 00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:12,450 [INAUDIBLE]. 941 00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,252 AUDIENCE: I like basically hidden rules, goals, and 942 00:47:19,252 --> 00:47:20,925 keywords, and two different players 943 00:47:20,925 --> 00:47:23,322 playing the same character. 944 00:47:23,322 --> 00:47:24,801 Those are two mechanics I really like. 945 00:47:31,220 --> 00:47:34,930 PROFESSOR: We have a couple of seats out there. 946 00:47:34,930 --> 00:47:36,180 Caffeine helps, there's a bunch. 947 00:47:40,370 --> 00:47:42,820 What do we have on Friday? 948 00:47:42,820 --> 00:47:45,270 GUEST SPEAKER: On Friday we mostly just have brainstorming 949 00:47:45,270 --> 00:47:46,250 and team-building scheduled? 950 00:47:46,250 --> 00:47:48,220 That time is pretty flexible. 951 00:47:48,220 --> 00:47:51,735 PROFESSOR: S0 what I can do maybe, if folks can plan to 952 00:47:51,735 --> 00:47:56,200 come into Wednesday with a team, what I'm going to do is 953 00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:57,590 I might move my-- 954 00:47:57,590 --> 00:47:58,910 AUDIENCE: You mean Friday? 955 00:47:58,910 --> 00:48:02,320 PROFESSOR: --Sorry, Friday, yeah. 956 00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:04,695 Then I will move my live-action talk 957 00:48:04,695 --> 00:48:06,410 up to Friday instead. 958 00:48:06,410 --> 00:48:10,640 So Wednesday we can just-- since it seems like a lot of 959 00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:11,890 people are going in that direction. 960 00:48:15,180 --> 00:48:17,360 You don't have to do a live-action game, but it's one 961 00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:18,610 of my favorite games.