1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:00,420


2
00:00:00,420 --> 00:00:02,795
STEPHEN CARPENTER: We think
about conventional activities

3
00:00:02,795 --> 00:00:05,252
to expand thematic and
conceptual exploration.

4
00:00:05,252 --> 00:00:07,710
So the traditional ways or
maybe more conventional ways you

5
00:00:07,710 --> 00:00:12,720
might think about art education
or learning studio practices--

6
00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:16,256
sculpture, working with
clay, working with wood,

7
00:00:16,256 --> 00:00:20,882
working with paint,
or drawing practices--

8
00:00:20,882 --> 00:00:23,090
those are fine if we want
to develop a set of skills.

9
00:00:23,090 --> 00:00:28,080
But what about thinking about
concepts and themes and issues?

10
00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:31,140
Well, we might as well get
started and do some of that

11
00:00:31,140 --> 00:00:31,640
now.

12
00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:33,530
So we're going to make
a little transition.

13
00:00:33,530 --> 00:00:36,890
I'm going to set up a
still life over here.

14
00:00:36,890 --> 00:00:39,140
And we're going to
do some drawing.

15
00:00:39,140 --> 00:00:43,130
The range of ways
in which people draw

16
00:00:43,130 --> 00:00:46,574
is perfectly acceptable,
perfectly acceptable.

17
00:00:46,574 --> 00:00:48,490
So if you're concerned
that it's tough for you

18
00:00:48,490 --> 00:00:53,630
to draw a conclusion or
draw a straight line,

19
00:00:53,630 --> 00:00:55,321
don't be concerned by that.

20
00:00:55,321 --> 00:00:57,070
It's the process that
we're interested in,

21
00:00:57,070 --> 00:00:59,230
not the visual representation.

22
00:00:59,230 --> 00:01:01,510
We have the three
chairs in the center.

23
00:01:01,510 --> 00:01:06,710
With your marker, I would
like you to draw what you see.

24
00:01:06,710 --> 00:01:09,170
And you can draw it
on this paper the way

25
00:01:09,170 --> 00:01:10,320
that it makes sense to you.

26
00:01:10,320 --> 00:01:12,695
If you want to draw it as
large as you can, that's great.

27
00:01:12,695 --> 00:01:15,487
If you want to draw it
smaller, that's fine.

28
00:01:15,487 --> 00:01:17,570
But here's our still life,
these three chairs kind

29
00:01:17,570 --> 00:01:20,400
of sitting in relationship
to each other.

30
00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:26,060
We'll take about 8 to
10 minutes to draw this.

31
00:01:26,060 --> 00:01:27,350
Oh, but there's one thing.

32
00:01:27,350 --> 00:01:30,390
This is my-- there's
one more thing.

33
00:01:30,390 --> 00:01:33,800
You'll draw for 30
seconds at a time.

34
00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:36,070
And then after your
30 seconds is over,

35
00:01:36,070 --> 00:01:38,367
I have another task for you.

36
00:01:38,367 --> 00:01:40,450
So you're going to draw
the chairs for 30 seconds.

37
00:01:40,450 --> 00:01:43,720
And then I'll give you another
step to continue your drawing.

38
00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:44,800
Got it?

39
00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:52,160
All right, so when
you're ready, set, go.

40
00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:53,470
It's not a race.

41
00:01:53,470 --> 00:01:54,850
Just go, time starts now.

42
00:01:54,850 --> 00:02:00,560


43
00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:02,690
Try to put in as much
information as you can.

44
00:02:02,690 --> 00:02:11,390


45
00:02:11,390 --> 00:02:14,180
All right, stop, stop.

46
00:02:14,180 --> 00:02:16,040
Now, what you're
going to have to do

47
00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:21,170
is slide back in your chair,
slide back a little bit.

48
00:02:21,170 --> 00:02:24,020
And then stand up.

49
00:02:24,020 --> 00:02:26,700
And then move one
drawing to the left.

50
00:02:26,700 --> 00:02:30,410
So now you're standing in front
of somebody else's drawing,

51
00:02:30,410 --> 00:02:33,450
to the left.

52
00:02:33,450 --> 00:02:36,154
OK, stand in front of the next
person-- the next drawing.

53
00:02:36,154 --> 00:02:37,320
All right, now keep drawing.

54
00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:39,630
Continue the drawing that
this other person has started.

55
00:02:39,630 --> 00:02:40,130
Go.

56
00:02:40,130 --> 00:02:52,980


57
00:02:52,980 --> 00:02:55,720
All right, stop, move.

58
00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:59,280
Did you learn
something about drawing

59
00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:00,995
from other people's drawings?

60
00:03:00,995 --> 00:03:03,120
Like as you went through
and you sat down and said,

61
00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,034
oh, there were some things
happening at this new drawing

62
00:03:06,034 --> 00:03:07,950
that you're sitting at
that you hadn't thought

63
00:03:07,950 --> 00:03:10,500
about that maybe you
tried to replicate

64
00:03:10,500 --> 00:03:11,965
or you tried to avoid.

65
00:03:11,965 --> 00:03:13,590
LARRY SUSSKIND: My
attitude toward what

66
00:03:13,590 --> 00:03:17,550
I was doing changed rather
markedly in different parts

67
00:03:17,550 --> 00:03:18,480
of the circle.

68
00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:24,450
I started out with trying to
take the assignment literally.

69
00:03:24,450 --> 00:03:28,350
And I assumed that
somebody else, that's

70
00:03:28,350 --> 00:03:29,800
their representation of that.

71
00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:32,850
It's my job to add--

72
00:03:32,850 --> 00:03:35,520
to complete their
representation.

73
00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,640
But about over
there, by that time,

74
00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:42,210
since I couldn't figure
their representation

75
00:03:42,210 --> 00:03:45,450
relative to what I was looking
at, that I finally decided,

76
00:03:45,450 --> 00:03:47,940
well, I could contribute
something to this,

77
00:03:47,940 --> 00:03:50,340
but it isn't their
representation

78
00:03:50,340 --> 00:03:52,170
that I'm helping to finish.

79
00:03:52,170 --> 00:03:56,070
I'll just focus on adding
solid surfaces to ones

80
00:03:56,070 --> 00:03:57,540
that don't have solid surfaces.

81
00:03:57,540 --> 00:04:00,400
Because clearly, there
are some solid surfaces.

82
00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:05,220
So as I moved along, I was
making sure I added something.

83
00:04:05,220 --> 00:04:09,300
But I wasn't any longer
trying to complete

84
00:04:09,300 --> 00:04:12,880
what the message was
that the previous person,

85
00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:14,970
that the original
person had left.

86
00:04:14,970 --> 00:04:18,120
By the time I got
over there, I realized

87
00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:22,350
people were adding things
that were extraneous

88
00:04:22,350 --> 00:04:24,910
to the literal assignment.

89
00:04:24,910 --> 00:04:26,660
And I said, oh, I see.

90
00:04:26,660 --> 00:04:28,080
This is just a picture now.

91
00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:32,050
This is no longer a still life
that has to be represented.

92
00:04:32,050 --> 00:04:34,290
Now there's people just
making it into a picture.

93
00:04:34,290 --> 00:04:38,250
They're putting things that
are not there in the picture.

94
00:04:38,250 --> 00:04:40,180
Oh, OK, that's fun.

95
00:04:40,180 --> 00:04:44,730
And so now I realized that
the assignment had changed

96
00:04:44,730 --> 00:04:47,920
or my conception of it
had radically altered.

97
00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:49,710
And then by the time
I get back to my own,

98
00:04:49,710 --> 00:04:51,360
I recognized nothing.

99
00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:53,970
And I said, OK,
well I can barely

100
00:04:53,970 --> 00:04:56,550
find what I started with.

101
00:04:56,550 --> 00:04:59,190
There's layers of what
other people produced.

102
00:04:59,190 --> 00:05:02,790
But my sense of what
I was doing changed

103
00:05:02,790 --> 00:05:07,050
as there were changes
imposed by many people

104
00:05:07,050 --> 00:05:09,580
before me getting
to the picture.

105
00:05:09,580 --> 00:05:12,560
STEPHEN CARPENTER: Man,
that's such a wonderful--

106
00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:14,880
I want to transition to
the next drawing task.

107
00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,850
But inherent in what
everyone was saying

108
00:05:17,850 --> 00:05:23,010
could be applied to other
tasks, other subjects.

109
00:05:23,010 --> 00:05:25,920
Imagine if we didn't have
a set of chairs there.

110
00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:28,770
Imagine if there
was a person there.

111
00:05:28,770 --> 00:05:30,930
Instead of drawing
with lines, we

112
00:05:30,930 --> 00:05:33,960
were drawing with the questions
we were asking this person who

113
00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:35,990
we had never met before.

114
00:05:35,990 --> 00:05:38,032
Or maybe we had passed
this person numerous times

115
00:05:38,032 --> 00:05:39,656
like we pass these
chairs all the time.

116
00:05:39,656 --> 00:05:41,160
These chairs are
just in the room.

117
00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,880
But now we put them
in a space of inquiry.

118
00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:46,290
Oh, now I have to look.

119
00:05:46,290 --> 00:05:49,267
I've learned some things about
these chairs in this circle

120
00:05:49,267 --> 00:05:50,850
that I didn't realize
about the chairs

121
00:05:50,850 --> 00:05:52,740
before, just by the
act of mark-making.

122
00:05:52,740 --> 00:05:55,350
So what if we put
a person there,

123
00:05:55,350 --> 00:05:58,355
someone we may pass on
the street everyday.

124
00:05:58,355 --> 00:06:00,480
And we just, we stopped--
instead of drawing them--

125
00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:02,813
we could draw them-- what if
we asked questions of them?

126
00:06:02,813 --> 00:06:04,680
What if each mark
that we're making

127
00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,744
is some form of a question
that we're asking?

128
00:06:07,744 --> 00:06:09,660
How much more would we
learn about that person

129
00:06:09,660 --> 00:06:12,230
just by talking to them?

130
00:06:12,230 --> 00:06:16,844
The idea here will be that
we'll still use the chairs.

131
00:06:16,844 --> 00:06:19,010
And we're still building
on this premise of learning

132
00:06:19,010 --> 00:06:21,650
from each other's drawings.

133
00:06:21,650 --> 00:06:26,030
But now instead of us
all drawing and moving

134
00:06:26,030 --> 00:06:29,090
to each other's
drawings, one person

135
00:06:29,090 --> 00:06:32,060
will take the drawing
implement and you

136
00:06:32,060 --> 00:06:36,602
will be connected, fixed
to that drawing implement.

137
00:06:36,602 --> 00:06:38,060
In other words,
you're an extension

138
00:06:38,060 --> 00:06:39,680
of that drawing implement.

139
00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,500
And your partner
has to find a way

140
00:06:42,500 --> 00:06:48,730
to use you, the drawing
implement, to draw the chairs.

141
00:06:48,730 --> 00:06:50,230
All you're doing,
drawing implement,

142
00:06:50,230 --> 00:06:54,220
is holding the marker.

143
00:06:54,220 --> 00:06:57,010
The person who is your
partner is using--

144
00:06:57,010 --> 00:06:59,110
they might have to hold
your hand or your elbow

145
00:06:59,110 --> 00:07:01,269
or your shoulder or
shoulder and wrist.

146
00:07:01,269 --> 00:07:03,310
That's why I'm saying need
to have the permission

147
00:07:03,310 --> 00:07:05,330
of the other person.

148
00:07:05,330 --> 00:07:08,450
And then they're going
to draw what they see,

149
00:07:08,450 --> 00:07:11,690
they're going to draw
the chairs using you

150
00:07:11,690 --> 00:07:14,219
and the marker as the implement.

151
00:07:14,219 --> 00:07:15,260
And you're the implement.

152
00:07:15,260 --> 00:07:20,542
You're kind of in it to see
how this drawing turns out.

153
00:07:20,542 --> 00:07:26,910
[INTERPOSING VOICES]

154
00:07:26,910 --> 00:07:38,955


155
00:07:38,955 --> 00:07:40,580
STEPHEN CARPENTER:
So some of the words

156
00:07:40,580 --> 00:07:44,780
I'm hearing that, to me, work
in tandem with this notion

157
00:07:44,780 --> 00:07:47,930
of themes or concepts--

158
00:07:47,930 --> 00:07:52,460
responsibility, influence,
some notion of liberation

159
00:07:52,460 --> 00:07:57,110
in what you said over
there, right, cooperation.

160
00:07:57,110 --> 00:07:59,870
So these are themes
or concepts that

161
00:07:59,870 --> 00:08:02,810
might be important to many
disciplines or many discourses.

162
00:08:02,810 --> 00:08:06,882
But one way we might get to
it could be doing an activity

163
00:08:06,882 --> 00:08:08,840
like this, even though
this activity could also

164
00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:13,190
be taken very literally in
terms of formal approaches

165
00:08:13,190 --> 00:08:17,450
to revise and enhance
the way people render,

166
00:08:17,450 --> 00:08:20,587
through drawings, who
render realistically

167
00:08:20,587 --> 00:08:21,920
the objects that they're seeing.

168
00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:23,378
But there's also
a conceptual piece

169
00:08:23,378 --> 00:08:25,780
here that we don't want to miss.

170
00:08:25,780 --> 00:08:36,085